vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD

mtb650 · 23-06-2006, 00:02

Out of interest does anyone know the comparisons between a vRS and an Alfa 1.9 JTD.
They look very similar on paper, apart from Alfa list price being far higher, although I imagine good discounts are available.

Cheers

Fabia156 · 23-06-2006, 00:24

Well the Alfa 1.9 JTD comes in 115 BHP and 150 BHP.. the VRS is surely better than the 115 HP version due to the weight differece.. but the Alfa 147 looks alot better and handles very well.. and the interior is really good quality and great looks.. torque is 305 Nm at 2000 rpm in the 150 BHP version.. the Alfa 147 feels really great to be in.. it feels like a very sporty car and the drivin position is great.. very comfortable car

johnjohnhealy · 23-06-2006, 04:50

Alfas are also one of the few front wheel drive cars that can actually put there power down onto the road rather than just rely on traction control to keep the wheelspin to a minimum like Skoda seem to.

ChrisRs · 23-06-2006, 07:27

Very nice car BUT......Its owned by Fiat!! The dealer network is crap, the cars plummet in value and the reliability is suspect too. A good second hand 150 hp 156 would be very nice but I would get it serviced outside the dealer network

Neily03 · 23-06-2006, 08:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjohnhealy

Alfas are also one of the few front wheel drive cars that can actually put there power down onto the road rather than just rely on traction control to keep the wheelspin to a minimum like Skoda seem to.

Like the 147 GTA??

HellFire · 23-06-2006, 08:13

the 147 is apparently durable as is the Alfa GT which is claimed to have similar reliability to it's German counterparts. The quality has improved a lot as Fiat have put lots of money into Alfa, also GM no longer owns Fiat as they bought themselves out of the contract for near £1 billion.

lozgti · 23-06-2006, 08:58

I love Alfas,just never heard a good story yet though

Is that JTD Fiats engine or Alfa R?

Fabia156 · 23-06-2006, 11:44

Reliability of the new alfa romeo models is very good... i know some mates who own alfas that never gone wrong... Quality is improved in an impressive way in the new models like the facelifted 147, 156, 166 etc.. and yet the new range is made with quality thats said to be better than the germans.. I love the new Brera and 159.. new alfa 149 is coming very soon so if your plannin to get a 147 save it now coz the 149 is coming very soon and its gonna look like the concept car 8C...

New Brera Interior.... srry for goin off the JTD thing but i cant help it

HellFire · 23-06-2006, 11:51

JTD is an excellent engine, Multijet technology which is apparently a class leading diesel engine, not read much about it though I must admit so I can't give any technical info.

Fabia156 · 23-06-2006, 12:21

Yup i read somewhere that its the most powerful engine in its class

lozgti · 23-06-2006, 12:36

Also going offf the JTD thing...beautiful steering wheels too.

Brera convertible looks stunning too.

MC Bodge · 23-06-2006, 12:41

Fairly recent (~4 years ago) Alfas owned by friends have still been rubbish as far as reliability and expensive breakdowns are concerned. I'd wait for a few years more before buying one!

cmcm789 · 23-06-2006, 12:43

I had always thought about Alfas, and even went as far as getting some prices for the new 147 before buying the Octy.

I was surprised that although they still have a bad reputation for reliability etc, that the 147 is still holding it's price very well. I know i couldn't get a 115JTD one or two years old for anywhere near the price i paid for the Octy.

JD

johnjohnhealy · 23-06-2006, 15:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neily03

Like the 147 GTA??

Yes!

147 GTA puts it's power down very well, you have to keep in mind that it's a 3.2 V6 with 24 valves, 4 camshafts and variable valve timing though!

Imagine how badly a Skoda would perform with that kind of power, Our Octy SDi's cant keep wheelspin at bay without electronic interference, and my Superb 130pd is a joke at times!

Alfa (or fiat) have invested so much money in recent years as they are desparate to rid themselves of the image that was created during the late 70's and early 80's that the cars are now very good quality and very reliable, they must be really as i'm considering a 159 as my next taxi, Alfa are also the only manufacturer who supply a turbo boost guage in the diesels!!

James B · 23-06-2006, 17:41

have got a fiat 1.9 multijet in my punto- 100hp more than enough in a mk2b seems quicker than dad's 1.9tdi 130 superb but around the same as his old 1.8T( which I wrote off

)- apparently is similar 0-60 wise as fabia vrs due to mine only weighing 1075 kilos

BrOwS · 23-06-2006, 18:19

Quick compare Grande Punto Sporting 1.9 Multijet against the vRS

Power
Both 130bhp

Torque
Skoda 229lb ft @ 1900rpm Punto 207lb ft @ 2000rpm

0-60 mph
Skoda 9.6 seconds Punto 9.5 seconds

Max Speed
Skoda 126mph Punto 124mph

Town mpg
Skoda 42.2 Punto 36.2

Out of Town mpg
Skoda 67.3 Punto 60.1

Average mpg
Skoda 55.4 Punto 48.7

More torque and better fuel consumption for the vRS. Thought these Multijet engines were better?!

James B · 23-06-2006, 18:32

In all fairness the new punto is fat as hell, but must admit was expecting better of the 1.9 multijet engine- the truly great multijet engine is the 1.3 as it is very light etc etc and develops up to 90hp in standard output- the 1.9 multijet is merely an update of the old jtd engine as far as i am aware- i have an 8v 1.9 multijet where the grande has 16v

my old punto mk2b does 9.5 according to fiat with 100hp

Fabia156 · 23-06-2006, 20:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjohnhealy

Yes!

147 GTA puts it's power down very well, you have to keep in mind that it's a 3.2 V6 with 24 valves, 4 camshafts and variable valve timing though!

Imagine how badly a Skoda would perform with that kind of power, Our Octy SDi's cant keep wheelspin at bay without electronic interference, and my Superb 130pd is a joke at times!

Alfa (or fiat) have invested so much money in recent years as they are desparate to rid themselves of the image that was created during the late 70's and early 80's that the cars are now very good quality and very reliable, they must be really as i'm considering a 159 as my next taxi, Alfa are also the only manufacturer who supply a turbo boost guage in the diesels!!

Well said mate.. and a great choice too.. the new 159 is ecxcellent and its won every test it went through.. As for the Alfa romeo Dealer network.. They're working on improving that as well.. alfa romeo is really tryin hard to go back to the old days when they used be nuthing but race winners.. They're also going back to the US market very soon.. the future engine will have new technologies and that will be on the brera, 159 and 149

Diesel top 3 engines
1. Fiat Auto 1.9JTDm 175hp/360nm 92hp/lt & 190nm/lt
2. BMW "35d" 3.0lt TwinTurbo 272hp/560nm 91hp/lt 187nm/lt
3. Renault 2.0 DCi 175hp/360nm 88hp/lt 180nm/lt

As for the future diesel engines by Alfa
2.4JTDm 220/225hp Spring of 2007
3.0JTDm Autumn of 2007

xaser04 · 23-06-2006, 21:26

Fabia anyday for me.

Regardless of which is the better car (fabia imo) I couldn't bear thinking about the ridiculous depreciation of the alfa.

johnjohnhealy · 24-06-2006, 00:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by xaser04

Fabia anyday for me.

Regardless of which is the better car (fabia imo) I couldn't bear thinking about the ridiculous depreciation of the alfa.

You obviously haven't been and asked your Skoda dealer what yours is worth as a trade in then!!

LIGHTNIN · 24-06-2006, 00:10

My mate had a 147 before he upgraded to a 1.9Tdi Audi A3.The cabin in the 147 is fantastic ,its like a mix between a limo and a fighters cockpit. All the controls and dials are angled towards the driver. Great place to sit and drive, however it did tend to fall apart slowly.However the newever generation Alfa`s are supposed to be better built, famous last words!

xaser04 · 24-06-2006, 08:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjohnhealy

You obviously haven't been and asked your Skoda dealer what yours is worth as a trade in then!!

still probably more than a year old alfa.

HellFire · 24-06-2006, 09:05

I doubt it, and the Alfa doesnt look like an egg box with wheels.

ScoobyChris · 24-06-2006, 09:12

In the past, I never understood the whole Alfa thing that Clarkson et al preached about. That was until a member of the HPC took me out in his "crappy" old 150bhp FWD Alfa.

I've read excellent reviews of the JTD lump so I'll have to swing by my local dealer and sort out a test drive

Chris

Fabia156 · 24-06-2006, 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellFire

I doubt it, and the Alfa doesnt look like an egg box with wheels.

Trust me a year old alfa doesnt depreciate so much.. i think that Skodas Depreciate just as bad as alfas... Alfas are one of the best FWD cars and if you test drive a new GT you'll know wut i mean.. its an amazing car to drive and doesnt feel like FWD even it has got 240 BHP at the front wheels

23-06-2006, 00:02	#1
mtb650 Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 26 Members Car: Fabia vRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Out of interest does anyone know the comparisons between a vRS and an Alfa 1.9 JTD. They look very similar on paper, apart from Alfa list price being far higher, although I imagine good discounts are available. Cheers

23-06-2006, 00:24	#2
Fabia156 Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Dubai Posts: 619 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Well the Alfa 1.9 JTD comes in 115 BHP and 150 BHP.. the VRS is surely better than the 115 HP version due to the weight differece.. but the Alfa 147 looks alot better and handles very well.. and the interior is really good quality and great looks.. torque is 305 Nm at 2000 rpm in the 150 BHP version.. the Alfa 147 feels really great to be in.. it feels like a very sporty car and the drivin position is great.. very comfortable car __________________ 1.4 16V Last edited by Fabia156; 23-06-2006 at 00:25.

23-06-2006, 04:50	#3
johnjohnhealy Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: UK south east Posts: 2,428 Members Car: Superb 130pd Thanks: 1 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Alfas are also one of the few front wheel drive cars that can actually put there power down onto the road rather than just rely on traction control to keep the wheelspin to a minimum like Skoda seem to.

23-06-2006, 07:27	#4
ChrisRs Skonda Fabic Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,962 Members Car: Honda Civic 2.2 i-ctdi Type S GT Thanks: 16 Thanked 20 Times in 19 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Very nice car BUT......Its owned by Fiat!! The dealer network is crap, the cars plummet in value and the reliability is suspect too. A good second hand 150 hp 156 would be very nice but I would get it serviced outside the dealer network

23-06-2006, 08:13	#6
HellFire Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire Posts: 3,174 Members Car: Skoda Fabia vRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD the 147 is apparently durable as is the Alfa GT which is claimed to have similar reliability to it's German counterparts. The quality has improved a lot as Fiat have put lots of money into Alfa, also GM no longer owns Fiat as they bought themselves out of the contract for near £1 billion. __________________ Metro Blue '06' 5 Door Astra 1.8 SRi

23-06-2006, 08:58	#7
lozgti Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: midlands Posts: 5,743 Members Car: Thanks: 10 Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD I love Alfas,just never heard a good story yet though Is that JTD Fiats engine or Alfa R?

23-06-2006, 11:44	#8
Fabia156 Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Dubai Posts: 619 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Reliability of the new alfa romeo models is very good... i know some mates who own alfas that never gone wrong... Quality is improved in an impressive way in the new models like the facelifted 147, 156, 166 etc.. and yet the new range is made with quality thats said to be better than the germans.. I love the new Brera and 159.. new alfa 149 is coming very soon so if your plannin to get a 147 save it now coz the 149 is coming very soon and its gonna look like the concept car 8C... New Brera Interior.... srry for goin off the JTD thing but i cant help it __________________ 1.4 16V

23-06-2006, 11:51	#9
HellFire Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire Posts: 3,174 Members Car: Skoda Fabia vRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD JTD is an excellent engine, Multijet technology which is apparently a class leading diesel engine, not read much about it though I must admit so I can't give any technical info. __________________ Metro Blue '06' 5 Door Astra 1.8 SRi

23-06-2006, 12:21	#10
Fabia156 Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Dubai Posts: 619 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Yup i read somewhere that its the most powerful engine in its class __________________ 1.4 16V

23-06-2006, 12:36	#11
lozgti Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: midlands Posts: 5,743 Members Car: Thanks: 10 Thanked 12 Times in 12 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Also going offf the JTD thing...beautiful steering wheels too. Brera convertible looks stunning too.

23-06-2006, 12:41	#12
MC Bodge Briskodian Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: North West England Posts: 899 Members Car: Octavia vRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Fairly recent (~4 years ago) Alfas owned by friends have still been rubbish as far as reliability and expensive breakdowns are concerned. I'd wait for a few years more before buying one! __________________ Mk1 Octavia vRS. The thinking man's Hot Hatch. PS. Give Cyclists Room! We're quite vulnerable. If I can slap your window, you're too close

23-06-2006, 12:43	#13
cmcm789 Briskodian Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 965 Members Car: Octy Elegance 110 TDI (2003) Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD I had always thought about Alfas, and even went as far as getting some prices for the new 147 before buying the Octy. I was surprised that although they still have a bad reputation for reliability etc, that the 147 is still holding it's price very well. I know i couldn't get a 115JTD one or two years old for anywhere near the price i paid for the Octy. JD __________________ Octy Elegance TDI (110bhp)

23-06-2006, 17:41	#15
James B Briskodian Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 11 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD have got a fiat 1.9 multijet in my punto- 100hp more than enough in a mk2b seems quicker than dad's 1.9tdi 130 superb but around the same as his old 1.8T( which I wrote off )- apparently is similar 0-60 wise as fabia vrs due to mine only weighing 1075 kilos

23-06-2006, 18:19	#16
BrOwS Briskodian Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Farnborough Posts: 150 Members Car: Fabia vRS Thanks: 2 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Quick compare Grande Punto Sporting 1.9 Multijet against the vRS Power Both 130bhp Torque Skoda 229lb ft @ 1900rpm Punto 207lb ft @ 2000rpm 0-60 mph Skoda 9.6 seconds Punto 9.5 seconds Max Speed Skoda 126mph Punto 124mph Town mpg Skoda 42.2 Punto 36.2 Out of Town mpg Skoda 67.3 Punto 60.1 Average mpg Skoda 55.4 Punto 48.7 More torque and better fuel consumption for the vRS. Thought these Multijet engines were better?! __________________ Past 1999(V) Seicento Sporting (ITG Induction Kit, Red Dot Brakes, Janspeed Exhaust) Past 2002(52) Punto Sporting (ECU Remap) Present 2006(06) Skoda Fabia vRS (ESP, Xenons, Cruise Control, Heated Seats, Leather Interior, CD Changer) Future Koenigsegg CCX (With Top Gear Spoiler)

23-06-2006, 18:32	#17
James B Briskodian Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 11 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD In all fairness the new punto is fat as hell, but must admit was expecting better of the 1.9 multijet engine- the truly great multijet engine is the 1.3 as it is very light etc etc and develops up to 90hp in standard output- the 1.9 multijet is merely an update of the old jtd engine as far as i am aware- i have an 8v 1.9 multijet where the grande has 16v my old punto mk2b does 9.5 according to fiat with 100hp

23-06-2006, 21:26	#19
xaser04 Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Somerset Posts: 66 Members Car: 2006 '06' Octavia vRS (Black Magic) Thanks: 1 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD Fabia anyday for me. Regardless of which is the better car (fabia imo) I couldn't bear thinking about the ridiculous depreciation of the alfa. __________________ '04' Corrida Red Fabia vRS <---- What a car! ! ! '55' Silver Octavia 2.0TDI Sport

24-06-2006, 00:10	#21
LIGHTNIN Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Ireland Posts: 76 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD My mate had a 147 before he upgraded to a 1.9Tdi Audi A3.The cabin in the 147 is fantastic ,its like a mix between a limo and a fighters cockpit. All the controls and dials are angled towards the driver. Great place to sit and drive, however it did tend to fall apart slowly.However the newever generation Alfa`s are supposed to be better built, famous last words!

24-06-2006, 09:05	#23
HellFire Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire Posts: 3,174 Members Car: Skoda Fabia vRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 2 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD I doubt it, and the Alfa doesnt look like an egg box with wheels. __________________ Metro Blue '06' 5 Door Astra 1.8 SRi

24-06-2006, 09:12	#24
ScoobyChris Briskodian Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Andover Posts: 18,265 Members Car: Fiat Panda Thanks: 16 Thanked 352 Times in 303 Posts	Re: vRS v Alfa 1.9 JTD In the past, I never understood the whole Alfa thing that Clarkson et al preached about. That was until a member of the HPC took me out in his "crappy" old 150bhp FWD Alfa. I've read excellent reviews of the JTD lump so I'll have to swing by my local dealer and sort out a test drive Chris __________________ Holding up the traffic in a little Italian..........

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