when to use ASR ?

class37 · 07-10-2005, 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by aixlad

Let's hope the Ambulance driver turns his off then, after he's shovelled you up off the road

lol

Shifty · 07-10-2005, 18:27

I just popped in to see what the thread was about, and I can't believe it.

In fact i'm speechless at some of the comments.

Why is someone going to need an ambulance because they think that ASR should be off all the time?

If you are pushing the car to it's limit and enjoying yourself, wherever that may be, the last thing you need is an electronic co-pilot killing your revs when your back end is sliding round a corner

Then you would need an ambulance.

And whats this powersliding business if you switch it off? Does switching the ASR off force you, the driver, to apply too much throttle in a bend?

If you are unexpectedly "powersliding" around corners merely because you have turned off your traction control, and suprised by your back end being "happy", which I assume means light, I would suggest you slow down on said corners before you kill someone.

It is fitted as a driver aid, should you wish to be aided. Some poeple like to drive for enjoyment, and don't wish to be aided. If you do wish to have your ASR on, then thats fine and dandy, but why tell other poeple it's dangerous to have it switched off, or it could cause an accident?

Relying on things like ASR, ESP, and even ABS, is more dangerous in my opinion than not having them at all.

Driving normally, fair enough, yes they make the car safer, but when you are having a blast down your favorite twisties, or on a track, they are nothing more than a hinderance.

Shifty · 07-10-2005, 18:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tigger_1979

Goochie we need to run a little test
to of the same car one run with ASR on other run with ASR off
can we borrow your airfield

On my car, I timed the 0-60 in 10 secs with it on (+23 stone passenger) 3 times, and 7.5 with it off. (before the remap). But two xcars side by side as you say would be interesting. Not that a couple of seconds shaved off the 0-60 time helps you get to work any quicker.. (not you....you know what i mean

)

logiclee · 07-10-2005, 18:32

Did anyone see the test on topgear or fithgear they did with a 3 series.

Driver went up the mountain road with everything turned off, think it may have been Tiff.

Lots of race car driving up the hill and at the top he was sweating like a pig.

Second run up all the driver aids were turned on, he complained all the way up that the car was cutting power and slowing the car too much.

Yet the second run was over five seconds quicker. Just goes to show that the brain can convince you that you are going faster due to the extra noise and effort.

I think I'm right in saying that turning ASR off does not disable EDL on cars with it fitted so your spinning wheel will be braked at low speed.

Cheers
Lee

walkie · 07-10-2005, 18:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shifty

I just popped in to see what the thread was about, and I can't believe it.

In fact i'm speechless at some of the comments.

Why is someone going to need an ambulance because they think that ASR should be off all the time?

If you are pushing the car to it's limit and enjoying yourself, wherever that may be, the last thing you need is an electronic co-pilot killing your revs when your back end is sliding round a corner

Then you would need an ambulance.

And whats this powersliding business if you switch it off? Does switching the ASR off force you, the driver, to apply too much throttle in a bend?

It is fitted as a driver aid, should you wish to be aided. Some poeple like to drive for enjoyment, and don't wish to be aided. If you do wish to have your ASR on, then thats fine and dandy, but why tell other poeple it's dangerous to have it switched off, or it could cause an accident?

Relying on things like ASR, ESP, and even ABS, is more dangerous in my opinion than not having them at all.

I would never buy a car with traction control that can't be de-activated. It just takes out too much involvement.

I was going to have my own little rant but you summed it up in a nutshell there...

tbh makes me laugh - some people

Shifty · 07-10-2005, 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by walkie

I was going to have my own little rant but you summed it up in a nutshell there...

tbh makes me laugh - some people

You can count on me to tell it like it is mate.

logiclee · 07-10-2005, 18:46

Does the vRS have EDL?

WW_VRS · 07-10-2005, 18:52

Hopefully I was not included in those you are surprised about

I dont rely on the features, but at the same time I dont bother turning them off, as normally they don't 'kick in'.

Either way - each to their own, it's not dangerous to turn them off, you just need to know what you're doing. On the track you'd definitely want them off

Cant say I even feel tempted to powerslide the Furby, I wouldnt feel safe with my level of driving skill. Again, if you are skilled enough, then why not

logiclee · 07-10-2005, 18:56

The only thing you will do if trying to power slide a FWD car is understeer straight on. Not much fun in that.

Lift off oversteer on track is fun though.

Cheers
Lee

Josh_PoloGTi · 07-10-2005, 21:53

I turn mine off on almost every journey.

I hate they way it cuts the power so abruptly, even mid corner (they way it cuts the power is like rapidly taking your foot off the gas... lift off oversteer anyone??).

The only times I have it on are when I'm in that "Can't be bothered" type of mood, when all I want to do is get to where I'm going and not think too much about driving (ie I'm not going to be going particularly quickly).

However, when I want to make progress, off it goes. I use my decent tyres and good control of my right foot to ensure my wheels don't spin unneccessarely (sp?).

ABS is great though, but I don't rely on it.

dsmithmobile · 07-10-2005, 21:58

I`m with josh on this cos i find it more of a pain than of any use so i turn mine off as soon as i get in the car

Johnnyc · 07-10-2005, 22:06

I read on a review of the 2.0 Tdi Golf MkV that even with ESP turned off, if you really get into trouble it turns itself back on. I'd imagine it's the same for Skoda's too.

drm_jones · 07-10-2005, 22:12

I almost always keep ASR on in mine - yes it does get annoying when it abruptly cuts the power but it does help the tyres live a little longer. Instead of ASR most of my mates reckon it should be called SMT - Save My Tyres

Skodaman · 07-10-2005, 22:45

I always leave it on and I haven't noticed any power cuts

, but as someone said with it off you can get 0-60 in 7.5 secs ! that sounds good I will have to try that !

drm_jones · 07-10-2005, 23:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skodaman

I always leave it on and I haven't noticed any power cuts

, but as someone said with it off you can get 0-60 in 7.5 secs ! that sounds good I will have to try that !

ASR will only cut the power if it detects that a wheel is spinning. Unfortunately it does this very brutally - ON boost --> OFF boost --> ON boost - almost giving you whiplash in the process.

Due to the higher torque in the Fabia vRS is probably more noticable than in an Octy vRS; judicious use of the right foot is sufficient to prevent ASR being activated.

Octygone · 08-10-2005, 00:06

Mine stays on most of the time ....just because I can't be bothered to turn it off and to be honest in most road conditions and driving sensibly you wont notice any difference,.......... but I do turn it off in ice and snow because it makes the car awful to drive and the constant on/off power is a pain in the neck.

johnjohnhealy · 08-10-2005, 06:17

Whats all this cr*p about 'powersliding'? are we turning into the max power brigade? if your driving a skoda you will be in a front wheel drive car and therefore you cannot 'powerslide'. all your doing is skiding as if you apply power while sliding the back of a front wheel drive car you will pull yourself out of the slide!

maybe my car is different as I have ESP not ASR but I dont find it abruptly cutting power, it's quite progressive.

I dont understand why you guys think you can drive your cars faster with it switched off? none of us can perform calculations as fast as the computers that are detecting wheelspin, in the time you've taken to decide to lift off a bit the computer will already have regained traction and be sending you off on your merry way rather than sitting in a cloud of tyre smoke as an artic bears down on you.

Driver aids were banned from F1 in order to SLOW DOWN the cars, certainly none of us can drive like schumacher and if he uses em they must work.

I guess its each to there own and all that but it just amuses me when people think they can do so much better than the millions of pounds invested in this type of technology.

drm_jones · 08-10-2005, 06:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnjohnhealy

maybe my car is different as I have ESP not ASR but I dont find it abruptly cutting power, it's quite progressive.

ESP brakes individual wheels that have lost traction - this may allow boost to be retained and hence avoid the jerkiness associated with ASR

.

WW_VRS · 08-10-2005, 08:24

Could be - I got ESP on mine and it does cut power a little bit, but it didnt seem as aggressive as the ASR car I had for the initial test drive.

Still - at least we have the option

Josh_PoloGTi · 08-10-2005, 08:58

JohnJohnHealy, what we're trying to say is that ASR is c rap.

ESP is a different kettle of fish (hence it's not included as standard, but is a pricy option).

I don't have ESP, I have the terrible ASR that does more harm than good.

I have experienced lift-off-oversteer in my car, driving sensibly but not slowly, up a windy hill. One of my wheels lost traction... No biggie, I'd have normally just eased off the throttle a little bit, but no, ASR thought it'd be a great idea to cut a whole bunch of power, causing a dramatic shift in weight to the front of the car as the car rapidly slowed down, which as I was mid-bend, caused the back end of my car to swing out!

I was not driving like a prat. I was just trying to get up a hill I've been up hundreds of times (often in far slippier conditions than that, in other cars that didn't have any kind of traction control).

What I'm saying is that until I bought this car, I've never had traction control before, and I've done ok. Thinking sensibly about it, I'd rather have control over my car than some half-baked attempt at "traction control".

Comparing traction control on an F1 car to the standard ASR that comes on a fabia is a bit off, don't you think? Chalk vs Cheese!

Either way, I have mine off. You can have yours on if you want.

logiclee · 08-10-2005, 17:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by drm_jones

ESP brakes individual wheels that have lost traction - this may allow boost to be retained and hence avoid the jerkiness associated with ASR

.

Not really.

ESP tries to cancel out understeer and oversteer by braking individual wheels that have traction to turn the car in. A bit like when the car pulls to one side when the brakes are uneven.
ASR and EDL work exactly the same on cars with ESP.
AYC (Active Yaw Control) in the Evo GSR's does the opposite of ESP, instead of baking an individual wheel it actually applies more power to the opposite wheel instead. So when you start to understeer or oversteer in a bend you 100% have to keep the power on.

I find the EDL system very good at getting you off the line but the ASR can kill the power when reapplying power when changing up into 2nd gear.

Cheers
Lee

Johnnyc · 08-10-2005, 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Octygone

Mine stays on most of the time ....just because I can't be bothered to turn it off and to be honest in most road conditions and driving sensibly you wont notice any difference,.......... but I do turn it off in ice and snow because it makes the car awful to drive and the constant on/off power is a pain in the neck.

I thought you only got your Superb. Where have you encountered snow and ice at this time of year?

WW_VRS · 08-10-2005, 17:46

The only thing with electronic aids/toys/whatever is that you need to know it's there. With ESP 'ON" you pretty much have to trust the car will keep ya pointing in the right direction. With it 'OFF' you are in control, which may be good or bad depending on skill, being tired, etc.

ESP seems to not be as annoying in the way it does it's business - perhaps as it's not killing the engine abruptly, unless you REALLY overdo it. ASR was pretty easy to get kicking in in the test car I drove.

I am still hoping to make enough time for an advanced driving course of some sort, perhaps after that I'll turn off the ESP

Johnnyc · 08-10-2005, 17:53

Good idea. Let's face it, we are all learning. Every prang or near miss we have just confirms it. Sad thing is by the time you are convinced you've mastered driving, your teenage kids will be telling you that your driving is getting worse.

**robmawer** · 08-10-2005, 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnnyc

Sad thing is by the time you are convinced you've mastered driving, your teenage kids will be telling you that your driving is getting worse.

So true...

Rob.

07-10-2005, 18:27	#27
Shifty Ex Modder Join Date: May 2005 Location: Blackpool. Posts: 6,647 Members Car: Omega 2.5 V6 CDX Auto Images: 2 Thanks: 93 Thanked 177 Times in 112 Posts	I just popped in to see what the thread was about, and I can't believe it. In fact i'm speechless at some of the comments. Why is someone going to need an ambulance because they think that ASR should be off all the time? If you are pushing the car to it's limit and enjoying yourself, wherever that may be, the last thing you need is an electronic co-pilot killing your revs when your back end is sliding round a corner Then you would need an ambulance. And whats this powersliding business if you switch it off? Does switching the ASR off force you, the driver, to apply too much throttle in a bend? If you are unexpectedly "powersliding" around corners merely because you have turned off your traction control, and suprised by your back end being "happy", which I assume means light, I would suggest you slow down on said corners before you kill someone. It is fitted as a driver aid, should you wish to be aided. Some poeple like to drive for enjoyment, and don't wish to be aided. If you do wish to have your ASR on, then thats fine and dandy, but why tell other poeple it's dangerous to have it switched off, or it could cause an accident? Relying on things like ASR, ESP, and even ABS, is more dangerous in my opinion than not having them at all. Driving normally, fair enough, yes they make the car safer, but when you are having a blast down your favorite twisties, or on a track, they are nothing more than a hinderance. __________________ <----- Add me on Xfire. Everyone knows someone called Dave. That's me - I'm Dave™ Last edited by Shifty; 07-10-2005 at 18:39.

07-10-2005, 18:32	#29
logiclee Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Notts, UK Posts: 787 Members Car: Octavia TDi Elegance, Fabia TDi Comfort Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Did anyone see the test on topgear or fithgear they did with a 3 series. Driver went up the mountain road with everything turned off, think it may have been Tiff. Lots of race car driving up the hill and at the top he was sweating like a pig. Second run up all the driver aids were turned on, he complained all the way up that the car was cutting power and slowing the car too much. Yet the second run was over five seconds quicker. Just goes to show that the brain can convince you that you are going faster due to the extra noise and effort. I think I'm right in saying that turning ASR off does not disable EDL on cars with it fitted so your spinning wheel will be braked at low speed. Cheers Lee __________________ Another Ex-Scooby owner. Mondeo TDCi 130 6 Speed Ghia, Octavia 1.9TDi Elegance (Now Sold), Fabia 1.9TDi Comfort and Felicia 1.9D GLi

07-10-2005, 18:46	#32
logiclee Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Notts, UK Posts: 787 Members Car: Octavia TDi Elegance, Fabia TDi Comfort Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Does the vRS have EDL? __________________ Another Ex-Scooby owner. Mondeo TDCi 130 6 Speed Ghia, Octavia 1.9TDi Elegance (Now Sold), Fabia 1.9TDi Comfort and Felicia 1.9D GLi

07-10-2005, 18:52	#33
WW_VRS Escorted Estate Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oxfordshire/Berkshire Posts: 9,961 Members Car: Ford Escort 1.6LX + Fab Estate Thanks: 48 Thanked 92 Times in 82 Posts	Hopefully I was not included in those you are surprised about I dont rely on the features, but at the same time I dont bother turning them off, as normally they don't 'kick in'. Either way - each to their own, it's not dangerous to turn them off, you just need to know what you're doing. On the track you'd definitely want them off Cant say I even feel tempted to powerslide the Furby, I wouldnt feel safe with my level of driving skill. Again, if you are skilled enough, then why not __________________ WW --->> Project Journal (pic links in first post there) Lummox'/Ross thread on Unit18 Automotive progress on my car: here

07-10-2005, 18:56	#34
logiclee Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Notts, UK Posts: 787 Members Car: Octavia TDi Elegance, Fabia TDi Comfort Thanks: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	The only thing you will do if trying to power slide a FWD car is understeer straight on. Not much fun in that. Lift off oversteer on track is fun though. Cheers Lee __________________ Another Ex-Scooby owner. Mondeo TDCi 130 6 Speed Ghia, Octavia 1.9TDi Elegance (Now Sold), Fabia 1.9TDi Comfort and Felicia 1.9D GLi

07-10-2005, 21:58	#36
dsmithmobile Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Hull,East Yorkshire Posts: 1,072 Members Car: 02 black magic octavia vrs Thanks: 0 Thanked 17 Times in 17 Posts	I`m with josh on this cos i find it more of a pain than of any use so i turn mine off as soon as i get in the car __________________ my car pics and spec here http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2309233

07-10-2005, 22:06	#37
Johnnyc Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 3,193 Members Car: MkV Golf 1.9 TDI Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts	I read on a review of the 2.0 Tdi Golf MkV that even with ESP turned off, if you really get into trouble it turns itself back on. I'd imagine it's the same for Skoda's too. __________________ Johnny "Americans have different ways of saying things. They say "elevator", we say "lift" ... they say "President", we say "stupid psychopathic git."

07-10-2005, 22:12	#38
drm_jones Worthless loser Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Nowhere of interest to anybody Posts: 1,034 Members Car: Unimportant Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I almost always keep ASR on in mine - yes it does get annoying when it abruptly cuts the power but it does help the tyres live a little longer. Instead of ASR most of my mates reckon it should be called SMT - Save My Tyres __________________ David 2002 Black Magic Octavia V/RS

07-10-2005, 22:45	#39
Skodaman Briskodian Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Guernsey, Channel Islands Posts: 35 Members Car: Black Fabia vRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I always leave it on and I haven't noticed any power cuts , but as someone said with it off you can get 0-60 in 7.5 secs ! that sounds good I will have to try that ! __________________ Skoda Fabia vRS, Black Magic Paint, CD Autochanger.

08-10-2005, 00:06	#41
Octygone Old Git Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Wiltshire Posts: 6,967 Members Car: Octavia Elegance combi 1.9tdi Images: 1 Thanks: 192 Thanked 128 Times in 84 Posts	Mine stays on most of the time ....just because I can't be bothered to turn it off and to be honest in most road conditions and driving sensibly you wont notice any difference,.......... but I do turn it off in ice and snow because it makes the car awful to drive and the constant on/off power is a pain in the neck.

08-10-2005, 06:17	#42
johnjohnhealy Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: UK south east Posts: 2,428 Members Car: Superb 130pd Thanks: 1 Thanked 13 Times in 12 Posts	Whats all this cr*p about 'powersliding'? are we turning into the max power brigade? if your driving a skoda you will be in a front wheel drive car and therefore you cannot 'powerslide'. all your doing is skiding as if you apply power while sliding the back of a front wheel drive car you will pull yourself out of the slide! maybe my car is different as I have ESP not ASR but I dont find it abruptly cutting power, it's quite progressive. I dont understand why you guys think you can drive your cars faster with it switched off? none of us can perform calculations as fast as the computers that are detecting wheelspin, in the time you've taken to decide to lift off a bit the computer will already have regained traction and be sending you off on your merry way rather than sitting in a cloud of tyre smoke as an artic bears down on you. Driver aids were banned from F1 in order to SLOW DOWN the cars, certainly none of us can drive like schumacher and if he uses em they must work. I guess its each to there own and all that but it just amuses me when people think they can do so much better than the millions of pounds invested in this type of technology.

08-10-2005, 08:24	#44
WW_VRS Escorted Estate Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oxfordshire/Berkshire Posts: 9,961 Members Car: Ford Escort 1.6LX + Fab Estate Thanks: 48 Thanked 92 Times in 82 Posts	Could be - I got ESP on mine and it does cut power a little bit, but it didnt seem as aggressive as the ASR car I had for the initial test drive. Still - at least we have the option __________________ WW --->> Project Journal (pic links in first post there) Lummox'/Ross thread on Unit18 Automotive progress on my car: here

08-10-2005, 17:46	#48
WW_VRS Escorted Estate Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oxfordshire/Berkshire Posts: 9,961 Members Car: Ford Escort 1.6LX + Fab Estate Thanks: 48 Thanked 92 Times in 82 Posts	The only thing with electronic aids/toys/whatever is that you need to know it's there. With ESP 'ON" you pretty much have to trust the car will keep ya pointing in the right direction. With it 'OFF' you are in control, which may be good or bad depending on skill, being tired, etc. ESP seems to not be as annoying in the way it does it's business - perhaps as it's not killing the engine abruptly, unless you REALLY overdo it. ASR was pretty easy to get kicking in in the test car I drove. I am still hoping to make enough time for an advanced driving course of some sort, perhaps after that I'll turn off the ESP __________________ WW --->> Project Journal (pic links in first post there) Lummox'/Ross thread on Unit18 Automotive progress on my car: here

08-10-2005, 17:53	#49
Johnnyc Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Northern Ireland Posts: 3,193 Members Car: MkV Golf 1.9 TDI Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 4 Posts	Good idea. Let's face it, we are all learning. Every prang or near miss we have just confirms it. Sad thing is by the time you are convinced you've mastered driving, your teenage kids will be telling you that your driving is getting worse. __________________ Johnny "Americans have different ways of saying things. They say "elevator", we say "lift" ... they say "President", we say "stupid psychopathic git."

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