Why change oil yearly?

Joey122mac · 18-12-2006, 23:15

Can someone please explain the idea behind having to change the oil on a yearly basis.

I understand the importance of oil but I think it should be changed every ten K miles.

I currently only drive 2 K miles a year so what benefit is it to change new oil for new oil - Seems like quite a shame to me.

Answers much appreciated

yaktrebor · 18-12-2006, 23:35

From what I understand...

Engine oil has an optimum operating temperature, designed around the engines normal running temperature.

So if you are running up and down the motorway all day, at optimum temp, then your oil will last a long time.

Just ask the variable servicing drivers, they get up to 20k miles out of their oil.
(A sensor in the engine checks the condition of the oil and tells you when to change it)

Anyway, if you are running very low mileage, a greater proportion of your yearly miles are driven with the engine/oil not at its optimum and therefore it will degrade faster.

I'm sure someone else will be along soon to add some additional gems of wisdom.

Mr Grumpy · 19-12-2006, 00:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joey122mac

Can someone please explain the idea behind having to change the oil on a yearly basis.

I understand the importance of oil but I think it should be changed every ten K miles.

I currently only drive 2 K miles a year so what benefit is it to change new oil for new oil - Seems like quite a shame to me.

Answers much appreciated

If you only drive 2K miles a year....
That equates to 40 miles a week roughly.
If you understand oil, and it seems a shame to use it..
You would be financially a lot better off using a taxi for your motoring needs, then you can blame the wastage of the worlds resources on someone else.
I'm not having a dig, but sell your car fella, and buy a pushbike

yaktrebor · 19-12-2006, 00:28

My Father only does about 2k a year in his car.

He used to get a new car every three years via Motability, until I convinced him that at 2k a year, he could probably keep the same car for 20 years and it would still be OK.

He now has a Honda HR-V ! (stereotypes are there for a reason

)

Therefore...... 1 car for 20 years = using less of the planets resources, as most of a cars carbon footprint is in the manufacture, not the running. (especially at 2k a year.)

Decron · 19-12-2006, 02:11

You can never change your oil enough.

An engine oil's job is primarily to stop all the metal surfaces in your engine from grinding together and tearing themselves apart from friction, and dissipating the heat generated from this process. It also transfers heat away from the combustion cycle and must be able to hold in suspension the nasty by-products of fuel combustion, such as silica (silicon oxide) and acids. It cleans the engine of such chemicals and buildups, and keeps the moving parts coated in oil. Doing this helps minimise exposure to oxygen and thus oxidation at higher temperatures. It does all of these things under tremendous heat and pressure. As well as with use, oil degrades with time, all the compounds and chemicals mentioned above can damage the engine if not removed. Condensation is also worse over time especially as the oil also absorbs moisture.

You don't have to change your oil but it is a proven fact that regular oil changes with good quaility oil will keep your motor running a lot sweeter and longer.

It's down to you at the end of the day.

Chris GB · 19-12-2006, 03:25

Hi

Quite possibly has to do with corrosion. Engine oil absorbs moisture from combustion processes and has to keep it in suspension. Also there will be a proportion of unburnt fuel in the oil. Running regualrly at full running temperature will help evaporate these contaminants out of the oil. Lots of short runs will have the opposite effect.

Chris

Babs · 19-12-2006, 12:00

had a chat with the dealer the other day about variable servicing. apparently the 2.0 TDI in the Octy can go 26,000m/2years between services. that means that a 3 year old car would only have ONE serivce.

I wouldn't buy it!

my Lupo has it's oil changed every 5000, so 3 times in the past year!

mluton · 19-12-2006, 12:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Babs

had a chat with the dealer the other day about variable servicing. apparently the 2.0 TDI in the Octy can go 26,000m/2years between services. that means that a 3 year old car would only have ONE serivce.

I wouldn't buy it!

my Lupo has it's oil changed every 5000, so 3 times in the past year!

They wouldnt introduce a variable service if they thought it would do more damage to the car.

I only do low milage around 7K - 9K a year and my car is setup for variable servicing. It had its first service at 20,100 miles and its second at 37,500 miles.

I dont see the problem.

Decron · 19-12-2006, 12:27

Different engine, different oil.

Technology is fantastic although if you thrash a VS car and then you may need it done every 6k

P-A · 19-12-2006, 16:12

Don't forget that manufacturers also set service intervals that make their cars as attractive as possible to leasing companies. For leasing companies servicing is expensive (ie. loss of earnings while a car is being serviced, more administration costs, and you can't lease a car when it's in the garage!). Therefore a car that can apparently cover 20,000 miles or two years between services is very attractive. Leasing companies and manufacturers don't really care what happens to the engine after the 3 year warranty has expired.

nottyash · 19-12-2006, 16:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joey122mac

Can someone please explain the idea behind having to change the oil on a yearly basis.

I understand the importance of oil but I think it should be changed every ten K miles.

Garages would go out of business!!
Your right, oil technologies have come on a long way. Using a good long life oil in theory eliminates the need for a yearly change.

Its easy money

KentStu · 19-12-2006, 16:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by mluton

They wouldnt introduce a variable service if they thought it would do more damage to the car.

I only do low milage around 7K - 9K a year and my car is setup for variable servicing. It had its first service at 20,100 miles and its second at 37,500 miles.

I dont see the problem.

Personally I disagree with that approach. VAG generally are not going to give a damn if your car blows up as along as its after the warranty period ... variable servicing or not they are long gone responsibility-wise. I am also a lowish mileage Octy RS driver at between 8 to 10k during the year with plenty of smallish runs and some spirited driving at times. Given the improtance of oil, the nature of my driving and the fact that I intend to keep the car for quite a while I always get the oil & some form of service done every year. Why not it doesn't cost much more?

Dieseline · 21-12-2006, 14:15

Diesel engines produce quit an amount of sulphur dioxide as a by-product of combustion. The blow-by gasses that get past the piston rings transfer this sulphurous gas into the engine sump where it mixes with the oil and any condensation in the engine. I'm no chemist, but as I understand, the sulphur content of the oil leeches out as sulphuric acid which can destroy engine components, especially engine bearings.
Hence, keep stale oil in your diesel engine at your peril!

bryand · 21-12-2006, 14:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dieseline

Diesel engines produce quit an amount of sulphur dioxide as a by-product of combustion.

Not since the introduction of Ultra Low Sulphur Diesel they don't.

WW_VRS · 21-12-2006, 15:55

How about soot

Babs · 22-12-2006, 00:21

how many variable serviced cars last over 100,000 miles?

it just strikes me as odd that (for example) a VS car can cover 100,000 miles and only see the inside of a garage FOUR times, and in that same 100,000 miles, a car that I owned would have seen the inside of a garage at least TWENTY times.

Dieseline · 22-12-2006, 00:33

error

Dieseline · 22-12-2006, 00:43

You can't say that bryand because "Ultra low sulphur" doesnt mean sulphur-free.

Tom_vRS · 22-12-2006, 01:01

VAG are hardly going to introduce a servicing regime that results in engine failures, inside of warranty or not. If every engine on VS went bang at 100k VW wouldn't be in business for long

The number of sensors on a VS car is bewildering, constantly measuring oil temp, oil quality, oil pressure, revs, vehicle speed etc etc... VW know what they are doing, if the car says it doesn't want servicing til 27k miles, then dont get it services til 27k miles. Likewise if it comes on a 6k miles (or 8500 like my mates PD leon), then get it done then.

Quality of modern oils is amazing, I see little point in chucking away perfectly good oil after just 5k. My Focus is on annual / 12.5k intervals. I plan to change at 10k ( I do 20k a year), and using a premium oil, this regime far exceeds the service schedule that Ford specify.

Dieseline · 22-12-2006, 02:06

All motor manufacturers are out to outdo one another with regards to extended servicing. One manufacturer comes along as quotes 10k miles between oil changes so then the other manufactureres feel that they are gong to loose out on sales if they dont extend their service regimes similarly.... just as with claims for fuel economy. .....And yes they are pushing their luck with the servicable life of the oil even though oil technology is quit impressive now.

So, how do the manufacturers cover themselves against the likelyhood that the oil will loose its efficiency if used for too long?..... you guessed it.... they add more and more sensors to the engine so hopefully the damage to the engine will be minimised so long as you get it serviced the moment the warning appears. Trouble is that by the time a sensor registers oil degradation or overheating or low oil pressure, the damage is already done. Lets all hope those sensors alarm with a reasonable safety margin.

adamC · 22-12-2006, 18:04

just my two peneth worth i change my oil every six mths so its new oil in for the winter to prtect the engine during cold starts, then change it as weather gets warmer usually october and march not sure it if actually benefits the car but makes me feel better LOL

WoodieGuthrie · 22-12-2006, 20:06

My BMW gets new oil every 6 k, and the felicia gets it every 5k. small price to pay for a smooth running lump.

TBH the oil does get dirty in that time- petrol/diesel make a helluva mess.

I know boys running LPG in the same BMW lumps as me, and oil is still crystal clear after 10k....

18-12-2006, 23:15	#1
Joey122mac Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 339 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Why change oil yearly? Can someone please explain the idea behind having to change the oil on a yearly basis. I understand the importance of oil but I think it should be changed every ten K miles. I currently only drive 2 K miles a year so what benefit is it to change new oil for new oil - Seems like quite a shame to me. Answers much appreciated

18-12-2006, 23:35	#2
yaktrebor Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Bakewell, Derbyshire, where the puddings come from. (That's tarts to foreigners!) Posts: 553 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? From what I understand... Engine oil has an optimum operating temperature, designed around the engines normal running temperature. So if you are running up and down the motorway all day, at optimum temp, then your oil will last a long time. Just ask the variable servicing drivers, they get up to 20k miles out of their oil. (A sensor in the engine checks the condition of the oil and tells you when to change it) Anyway, if you are running very low mileage, a greater proportion of your yearly miles are driven with the engine/oil not at its optimum and therefore it will degrade faster. I'm sure someone else will be along soon to add some additional gems of wisdom. __________________ 'No more beer!' (unless it's GF)

19-12-2006, 00:28	#4
yaktrebor Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Bakewell, Derbyshire, where the puddings come from. (That's tarts to foreigners!) Posts: 553 Members Car: Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? My Father only does about 2k a year in his car. He used to get a new car every three years via Motability, until I convinced him that at 2k a year, he could probably keep the same car for 20 years and it would still be OK. He now has a Honda HR-V ! (stereotypes are there for a reason ) Therefore...... 1 car for 20 years = using less of the planets resources, as most of a cars carbon footprint is in the manufacture, not the running. (especially at 2k a year.) __________________ 'No more beer!' (unless it's GF)

19-12-2006, 02:11	#5
Decron Eye Eye Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Cwmbran - South Wales Posts: 3,660 Members Car: Vroomster Thanks: 73 Thanked 269 Times in 197 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? You can never change your oil enough. An engine oil's job is primarily to stop all the metal surfaces in your engine from grinding together and tearing themselves apart from friction, and dissipating the heat generated from this process. It also transfers heat away from the combustion cycle and must be able to hold in suspension the nasty by-products of fuel combustion, such as silica (silicon oxide) and acids. It cleans the engine of such chemicals and buildups, and keeps the moving parts coated in oil. Doing this helps minimise exposure to oxygen and thus oxidation at higher temperatures. It does all of these things under tremendous heat and pressure. As well as with use, oil degrades with time, all the compounds and chemicals mentioned above can damage the engine if not removed. Condensation is also worse over time especially as the oil also absorbs moisture. You don't have to change your oil but it is a proven fact that regular oil changes with good quaility oil will keep your motor running a lot sweeter and longer. It's down to you at the end of the day. Last edited by Decron; 19-12-2006 at 03:57.

19-12-2006, 03:25	#6
Chris GB Briskodian Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: East UK Posts: 2,612 Members Car: Mini Cooper D Thanks: 19 Thanked 53 Times in 31 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? Hi Quite possibly has to do with corrosion. Engine oil absorbs moisture from combustion processes and has to keep it in suspension. Also there will be a proportion of unburnt fuel in the oil. Running regualrly at full running temperature will help evaporate these contaminants out of the oil. Lots of short runs will have the opposite effect. Chris __________________ Red Fabia vRS. Gone but not forgotten. Chilli Red / white Mini Cooper Diesel with dual controls. Silver 53 MR2. Mods: PPE 4>1 manifold \| PPE Mangnaflow high flow cat \| Blueflame catback exhaust \| Pikey inlet mod \| 3.0 Racing Chassis stiffening brace kit \| BC Racing fully adjustable coilovers \| TF loud. Details here My MR2 Page

19-12-2006, 12:00	#7
Babs Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Preston Posts: 4,227 Members Car: Vauxhall Corsa 1.2 16v Comfort Thanks: 221 Thanked 141 Times in 125 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? had a chat with the dealer the other day about variable servicing. apparently the 2.0 TDI in the Octy can go 26,000m/2years between services. that means that a 3 year old car would only have ONE serivce. I wouldn't buy it! my Lupo has it's oil changed every 5000, so 3 times in the past year! __________________ - Andrew In need of a new car, post your suggestions here!

19-12-2006, 12:27	#9
Decron Eye Eye Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Cwmbran - South Wales Posts: 3,660 Members Car: Vroomster Thanks: 73 Thanked 269 Times in 197 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? Different engine, different oil. Technology is fantastic although if you thrash a VS car and then you may need it done every 6k

19-12-2006, 16:12	#10
P-A Briskodian Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 460 Members Car: VRS Thanks: 0 Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? Don't forget that manufacturers also set service intervals that make their cars as attractive as possible to leasing companies. For leasing companies servicing is expensive (ie. loss of earnings while a car is being serviced, more administration costs, and you can't lease a car when it's in the garage!). Therefore a car that can apparently cover 20,000 miles or two years between services is very attractive. Leasing companies and manufacturers don't really care what happens to the engine after the 3 year warranty has expired.

21-12-2006, 14:15	#13
Dieseline Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hertford Posts: 56 Members Car: Fabia 2 PD1.9 TDI - July '08 Thanks: 6 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Why change oil yearly? Diesel engines produce quit an amount of sulphur dioxide as a by-product of combustion. The blow-by gasses that get past the piston rings transfer this sulphurous gas into the engine sump where it mixes with the oil and any condensation in the engine. I'm no chemist, but as I understand, the sulphur content of the oil leeches out as sulphuric acid which can destroy engine components, especially engine bearings. Hence, keep stale oil in your diesel engine at your peril!

21-12-2006, 15:55	#15
WW_VRS Escorted Estate Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oxfordshire/Berkshire Posts: 9,961 Members Car: Ford Escort 1.6LX + Fab Estate Thanks: 48 Thanked 92 Times in 82 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? How about soot __________________ WW --->> Project Journal (pic links in first post there) Lummox'/Ross thread on Unit18 Automotive progress on my car: here

22-12-2006, 00:21	#16
Babs Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Preston Posts: 4,227 Members Car: Vauxhall Corsa 1.2 16v Comfort Thanks: 221 Thanked 141 Times in 125 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? how many variable serviced cars last over 100,000 miles? it just strikes me as odd that (for example) a VS car can cover 100,000 miles and only see the inside of a garage FOUR times, and in that same 100,000 miles, a car that I owned would have seen the inside of a garage at least TWENTY times. __________________ - Andrew In need of a new car, post your suggestions here!

22-12-2006, 00:33	#17
Dieseline Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hertford Posts: 56 Members Car: Fabia 2 PD1.9 TDI - July '08 Thanks: 6 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Why change oil yearly? error Last edited by Dieseline; 22-12-2006 at 00:44.

22-12-2006, 00:43	#18
Dieseline Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hertford Posts: 56 Members Car: Fabia 2 PD1.9 TDI - July '08 Thanks: 6 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Why change oil yearly? You can't say that bryand because "Ultra low sulphur" doesnt mean sulphur-free. Last edited by Dieseline; 22-12-2006 at 00:44.

22-12-2006, 01:01	#19
Tom_vRS Briskodaholic Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Fenland, Cambridgeshire Posts: 11,788 Members Car: '97R BMW 328i Saloon Thanks: 728 Thanked 451 Times in 328 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? VAG are hardly going to introduce a servicing regime that results in engine failures, inside of warranty or not. If every engine on VS went bang at 100k VW wouldn't be in business for long The number of sensors on a VS car is bewildering, constantly measuring oil temp, oil quality, oil pressure, revs, vehicle speed etc etc... VW know what they are doing, if the car says it doesn't want servicing til 27k miles, then dont get it services til 27k miles. Likewise if it comes on a 6k miles (or 8500 like my mates PD leon), then get it done then. Quality of modern oils is amazing, I see little point in chucking away perfectly good oil after just 5k. My Focus is on annual / 12.5k intervals. I plan to change at 10k ( I do 20k a year), and using a premium oil, this regime far exceeds the service schedule that Ford specify. __________________ 97/R BMW 328i in Boston Green.

22-12-2006, 02:06	#20
Dieseline Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Hertford Posts: 56 Members Car: Fabia 2 PD1.9 TDI - July '08 Thanks: 6 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post	Re: Why change oil yearly? All motor manufacturers are out to outdo one another with regards to extended servicing. One manufacturer comes along as quotes 10k miles between oil changes so then the other manufactureres feel that they are gong to loose out on sales if they dont extend their service regimes similarly.... just as with claims for fuel economy. .....And yes they are pushing their luck with the servicable life of the oil even though oil technology is quit impressive now. So, how do the manufacturers cover themselves against the likelyhood that the oil will loose its efficiency if used for too long?..... you guessed it.... they add more and more sensors to the engine so hopefully the damage to the engine will be minimised so long as you get it serviced the moment the warning appears. Trouble is that by the time a sensor registers oil degradation or overheating or low oil pressure, the damage is already done. Lets all hope those sensors alarm with a reasonable safety margin.

22-12-2006, 18:04	#21
adamC Briskodian Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: close but not close enough Posts: 199 Members Car: BMW 120d SE Dynamic 177 BHP at the rear! My Second Car is the VRS black magic!! Love em both! Thanks: 0 Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? just my two peneth worth i change my oil every six mths so its new oil in for the winter to prtect the engine during cold starts, then change it as weather gets warmer usually october and march not sure it if actually benefits the car but makes me feel better LOL __________________ MINE: 08 Reg BMW 120d se Dynamic 177 hp 350 nm trqe. Wife: Saab 9-3 120 tdi linear sport Gone but not forgotten: 04 VRS black magic, octy 17 spiders, pd160 and K&N. Never did get the remap!

22-12-2006, 20:06	#22
WoodieGuthrie Briskodian Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Glasgow Posts: 813 Members Car: Totally Stock:-) Thanks: 6 Thanked 29 Times in 23 Posts	Re: Why change oil yearly? My BMW gets new oil every 6 k, and the felicia gets it every 5k. small price to pay for a smooth running lump. TBH the oil does get dirty in that time- petrol/diesel make a helluva mess. I know boys running LPG in the same BMW lumps as me, and oil is still crystal clear after 10k....

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode