Sachs Clutch...wos reckon?!

[Tomato Tom]

Not long bought an 04 Fabia VRS (second one, can't get enough!) that has been remapped by a previous owner (I didn't know at the time of purchase and should have taken it for a longer test run.... but in red it looks so pretty and there is nowt else wrong with it!). The clutch has started to slip and I think I need a new one .
I am interested in the Sachs organic clutch as I like the sound of what it does to the performance (sharper gear changes etc). I have no idea what to purchase (what sort, size, dual mass??! etc), who to talk to, where I can go to get the work done and exactly how much this will all cost (I have a rough idea of about £700). It also does not help that I do not know who remapped the car or what BHP or torque it has as a result (I'm guessing 160bhp as it's not actually that much faster than my mates standard one up until the higher revs)! All I know is I can't quite keep up with the new Octy VRS' , at 80mph I am doing 2,500rpm and I have to drive like a really, really old person to get the better side of 50mpg out of it! Any help would be useful!!

[jasc1988]

Sounds like your after the sachs clutch kit, best bet is to phone awesome performance / jabbasport etc.

Your standard DMF will be fine, so just the clutch kit is needed

[tfboy]

For a bit of background info, you may want to have a read of a couple of threads which discuss the Sachs clutch.

Ross' excellent thread (well, it started the whole Sachs investigation ) here

I then decided to go for the Sachs organic clutch and pressure plate (makes sense to do both at the same time), have a read here

In my book, it's a big as it doesn't require remachining of your standard DMF. The Helix is also good, and a few people here have it. I opted for the Sachs because I couldn't stand the rattle of Helix + SMF. Also, from a longetivity point of view, I reckon the sachs + DMF is better for the transmission because a SMF doesn't absorb the vibrations so much and people with SMF say it's really vibrates all the way through the gear box.

[jasc1988]

I run the Helix and SMF does chatter but the performance gains are amazing, gear changes are nice and crisp, bloody amazing all round really.

If your happy at remapped power 170bhp (ish) the sachs and dmf will last a lifetime but if you plan any further mods, hybrid turbo etc i'd suggest the Helix and SMF

But sounds the sachs will be fine for your needs

[bobjim]

where is the cheapest place to buy???

[jasc1988]

Cheapest i found the helix was mardi gras motorsport.

Dont know about the sachs,
Awesome performance are usually quite competitive,

Best bet is to phone the derv doctorm jabbasport and awesome to see what the best price is.

When i was hunting the prices varied by over £100 so pays to shop around

[Tomato Tom]

Oh dear this is all quite confusing but thanks for all your help folks, I'm definitely getting there!!
Basically I like the sound of what the Sachs does, and by the sound of it the clatter of the Helix would irritate me, although it does sound like a good set-up. I do a fair mileage in mine and I need it for everyday use on the motorway but love the pull of the remapped engine and would definitely appreciate the quicker gear changes as I do on the odd occasion drive it pretty hard. So, if I can afford it, I think I will go for the Sachs organic clutch and pressure plate as it seems to do what I want. I will shop around for the best prices, but please let me know if you feel as if I am making a big faux pas! The clutch slip is not bad so I assume that I will not need to replace the flywheel?!

[AwesomeSarah]

Had a chat with Sachs yesterday
It seems like they too are having a go at the SMF
But they dont want it to chatter like the Helix set up
They recon this should be available towards the end of May , but no prices as of yet
Sarah

[KLM]

Keep us updated Sarah!

I'm sure you will - any excuse to part us from our hard earned!

[Tomato Tom]

What is the advantage of the SMF over the DMF?!

[AwesomeSarah]

SMF is a single mass and DMF is dual , so in effect it can be half the weight
Which means that when you put your foot down some of the power is not used to power the heavy weight , but actually will go to the wheels

Oh dont worry , you know me
Sarah

[fireman]

hi sarah been reading this post and would like to ask you whats your best price for supply only the sachs clutch plate and cover please as i too will be needing a clutch. I can fit it myself no problem.

[bobjim]

yeah me too,
want it dirt cheap thou, i can beg if that helps

[AwesomeSarah]

Hi
The problem is Sachs have just upped their price by 7%
So I can give you a price , but maybe worth seeing if anyone has stock of them , unfortunately we dont so that would mean we have to buy it in and it will have their 7% increse
We can do them for £482.46 + VAT
This is for the clutch plate and pressure plate
I would also reccomend that you get the release bearing from a dealer , they are only approx £47 + VAT do that at the same time
Hope that helps you guys
Sarah

[Tomato Tom]

So a dual mass provides less power to the wheels but will cause less vibration as it i heavier and more balanced, a single mass provides more power to the wheels as it is lighter but causes more vibration as it is not so balanced.... right in a nutshell? So in that case, does a duel mass pass on more torque as it is a heavier weight?
Are these the only advantages to the two or are there other reasons why people chose one over the other?

[AwesomeSarah]

The way I describe it is :-
The DMF is like a sandwich , one slice of bread on the engine and one slice to the gearbox
The meat in the middle acts like the shockers and will take away the vibration from the engine
Remove that and put a SMF on and it is having toast , the vibration from the engine will then be trasformed from there and put through to the gearbox as you have removed the meat (shockers)
But if there is a bit of extra vibration if you put your foot on the clutch it is taken away sraight away
The main reason that people remove them , is because they do fail and can cause more vibration than a SMF and are expensive , plus the SMF is lighter so it used less power
Sarah

[Tomato Tom]

What a great way to describe it! So currently I have a sandwich in between the engine and the gearbox (that would explain the slipping!!) which I presume can be used with the sachs organic clutch kit and pressure plate. If my sandwich fails later down the line (catastrophic meat failure maybe?!), I may wish to upgrade to some nice hot buttered toast! I.e - I can fit the clutch kit and pressure plate without needing to worry about the flywheel as I only have a light remap and currently my sandwich is in good working order. Correct?!
Maybe it's the fact that I am a stoopid man and food comparisons just seem to work for me!

[AwesomeSarah]

Hey no , not stupid
This is almost how it was explained to me , so I can explain it better with food talk , especially when I have a tuna mayonaise DMF sat at the side of me
The Sachs kit we sell at the moment will not work with the SMF (toast) that will only work with the DMF (sarnie) you gotta love this
So that is why may people to the SMF as they will not know really until you get the gearbox off
The sarnies used to be approx £600 + VAT , so it was nearly as cheap to go for the Helix set up with the SMF than to go for the Sachs one then to find that you need the sarnie after all
Blimey I hope that you are getting this?
Anyone hungry now?
Sarah

[KLM]

Mmmmm - Lunch time me thinks!

[Tomato Tom]

Got it! Hence the Sachs SMF you mentioned earlier! In that case, I shall ponder my options over some lunch (real food I think today ) but I may well hold off until Sachs bring out their SMF system.
I guess it depends on prices, but what do you reckon I'd be looking at currently if I went for the Sachs kit and then had to replace it with another DMF (inc rough fitting costs)? Also, the same with the Helix (which I presume does not work with a DMF?). Also, are Sachs and Helix the only two available?

[AwesomeSarah]

At the moment the Sachs kit is £482.46 + VAT , if you was needing a new DMF you could be looking at approx £250 - £290 ish for the new DMF then the release bearing at approx £47 + VAT
The Helix kit comes with everything needed and is £790 + VAT
Fitting is £247.50 + VAT too
Hope that helps you?
Sarah

[jasc1988]

Originally Posted by AwesomeSarah

Had a chat with Sachs yesterday
It seems like they too are having a go at the SMF
But they dont want it to chatter like the Helix set up
They recon this should be available towards the end of May , but no prices as of yet
Sarah

This was quoted to be finished when i wanted one 4 months ago, no progress then

[jasc1988]

Originally Posted by Tomato Tom

Got it! Hence the Sachs SMF you mentioned earlier! In that case, I shall ponder my options over some lunch (real food I think today ) but I may well hold off until Sachs bring out their SMF system.
I guess it depends on prices, but what do you reckon I'd be looking at currently if I went for the Sachs kit and then had to replace it with another DMF (inc rough fitting costs)? Also, the same with the Helix (which I presume does not work with a DMF?). Also, are Sachs and Helix the only two available?

You can get a Spec jobbie from the states,

Also the Helix can cope with more torque than the sachs ,

But from reading all your comments dude you want the sachs

[AwesomeSarah]

Originally Posted by jasc1988

This was quoted to be finished when i wanted one 4 months ago, no progress then

This was the first I had heard about it to be honest
But I did ring and they said the end of May
I might just give them a call mid May to check and see how they are getting on
Give them grieve if required
Sarah

[jasc1988]

Originally Posted by AwesomeSarah

This was the first I had heard about it to be honest
But I did ring and they said the end of May
I might just give them a call mid May to check and see how they are getting on
Give them grieve if required
Sarah

Yeah i phoned Jabbasport a good 4 months ago for a Helix and they said that sachs had a new clutch with SMF and that was a week away, Jabbasport also said they would like to have used me as a guinea pig - so i thought sod that i'm not being a guinea pig and bought the helix