Fitting new ignition lock - need some advice...

familyskodaman · 29-06-2006, 13:33

Hi,
I got in my Felicia estate yesterday and the key wouldn't go into the ignition properly.

So I took apart the cowling etc and in the end I smashed the ignition barrel casing off, removed the steering lock bar and barrel. I'm running it fine holding the key next to the transponder and turning the ignition switch without barrel, but it's not so good if the taped up switch fell apart when my wife has the car..!

So I'd like to ask some advice before i replace the lock and find it doesn't work.

I'm thinking my best bet is a breakers to get a barrel complete with casing (mine is smashed...) from a scrap car (with key)

So can anyone help with these questions:

1. Am I right in saying the easiest way to get the casing off the scrap car is to drill through the bolts that bolt it to the steering column?? (The Haynes manual says hit them with a punch to turn them but it doesn't look that easy in reality, hence me smashing it off my own car when I had to get to work and didn't have a spare 4 hours..!)

2. what about the immobiliser?? now here's my thinking (and i hope you can follow it!) - I get the lock and key from the scrap car, then go and get a new key cut to match the scrap key (to fit the scrap lock) but get the immobiliser chip bit copied from my own key (to work my immobiliser) Will this work?

or has anyone go any better ideas? (new barrel would be good but I reckon I need to go to the scrappy anyway to get the casing bit as it's likely to be an expensive dealer only part??) Also, if anyone can tell me where to get a cheap new lock set that might come in handy if I don't find one..

One other question: after removing the cowling, unbolting the steering column and removing the barrel etc (and putting it together again) the low brake fluid level light has been on. The brake fluid is fine so I'm guessing I bumped a wire behind the dash??

Thanks for any help !

Andy.

marc moke · 30-06-2006, 02:11

Hi Andy.

Sorry I'm going to be of no help to you at all. But the thing is, I have the exact same problem. Well almost. The ignition barrel, in my Felicia (S reg), is jammed, but i have not yet done anything about fixing it.

I have ordered a new barrel and key (from skoda, it cost me around £50). But at the moment I'm stuck, with my haynes manuel 100 miles away.

So maybe you (or anyone else) could help me.

I have little or no knowledge about fixing cars, so please bear with me. But I have help from someone who does.

I've been told you have to remove the steering wheel before you can remove the barrel. Is this right? And do I not need a special tool to do this?

Beyond that, could anyone just advise me on how to go about replacing the barrel.
I will go and get my haynes manual before attempting anything. But any aditional help would be most appreciated.

Sorry for hijacking your thread Andy, but it seemed silly to start a new thread on almost the exact topic. But I will remove if its a problem.

Marc.

Lummox · 30-06-2006, 07:27

Very common fault on the Felicia this one. You should remove the shear bolts by tapping them around with a chisel or a punch and of course get new ones to replace them with.

You idea would work, using a second hand barrel and key and obtaining the security code and reprogramming the immobilizer.

You dont need to remove the steering wheel, the top trim will come out if you ease it up, you just need to drop the column so the barrel becomes accessable. Dont loose any wires off the back of the switch though. Might be worth making a picture of what wire goes where before removing them.

fordfan · 30-06-2006, 07:37

1 Disconnect the battery

2 Remove lower column shroud, you should be able to get away with out taking the top one off as you need to remove the steering wheel for this

3 Drop the column, 4 bolts (12mm I think) and make a note of where all the spacers and washers go.

4 Disconnect the electrical plugs for the stalk switches, airbag and horn.

5 At the back of the lock is a headless bolt (shear bolt), drill this centrally (use a nut pushed into the hole as a guide) and hammer a good quality interference fit Torx bit into it (Good quality because cheap ones break), get a socket and ratchet onto the bit and unscrew the shear bolt.

6 Remove the lock, take the switch off (2 grub screws).

The car can still be started by passing the key through the read coil and operating the switch with the end of the key.

Get a new lock, used ones are likely to have the same problem £60 or so + VAT.

The keys will need to be coded which you will need the 4 digit PIN (dealer job),
alternatively you could try swapping the transponders in the key, but they are quite well stuck in.

Don't re-assemble it and then expect to get the keys coded as
1 It won't start
2 If you do not have the PIN the dealer will require the immobiliser serial number to get it.

And of course Lummox beats me to it.

familyskodaman · 30-06-2006, 09:46

Hi,

thanks for the advice. Yesterday I tried the chisel and hammer to turn the shear bolt and it wasn't for moving. (just took chunks out it and the casing) then tried drilling it but the bolt is much harder than the casing so is difficult to drill.

That Torx bit trick and using a nut as a guide for the drill- fantastic advice FordFan, a voice of experience. (I didn't say, but I actually used to work as a mechanic and I'd forgotten that trick) - that's THE way to do it Marc.

Skoda can sell you a new barrel with all the mounting casing (right up to where it connects to the column) for £73 all in. So the mounting casing is only £21 which makes it tempting just to smash it (or preferably grind it) off as the casing is so soft. that's probably the way I'll go as I've already damaged the casing a bit.

Marc- the job is easy just follow the advice on here (I didnt remove the steering wheel) - only 1 screw under steering wheel then slide the bottom shrowd off (forwards or backwards). Top shrowd should have a screw removed which is just behind the steergin wheel at the top (you could get it with small grips without removing the steering wheel) - i just went for the pull it hard option and broke the plastic (it's gone back on fine) unbolt the 4 bolts under the steering column (yes- 12mm) and slide it down and yes- note where the washers etc go before you lower the column and they drop on the floor and you have to work out how they go... (yes I did that too) You won't need the Haynes manual, nothing in there that isn't posted here really. Getting off the shear bolt is hard though and will take some time.

About the immobiliser code- I've had copies of my original key made in the past (in a hardware store) and the guy copied the code from my original key to a new one he supplied and it worked fine. (he only took about £10 and I think he maybe used a vw transponder for the key but I'm not sure) So I guess the cheapest way to do it might be to find a key cutter who can copy the new key that you get with the barrel and also copy the code from your old key. You don't need to bother getting codes etc from Skoda then.

Thanks again for your help folks,

Andy

marc moke · 30-06-2006, 14:36

Thanks for the advice everyone.

familyskodaman · 30-06-2006, 17:51

ordered new parts from skoda today - turns out the mounting and new sheer bolts are only about £10.

thanks
Andy

Lummox · 30-06-2006, 17:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by familyskodaman

So I guess the cheapest way to do it might be to find a key cutter who can copy the new key that you get with the barrel and also copy the code from your old key. You don't need to bother getting codes etc from Skoda then.

The new key wont be coded. Its not coded to the barrell its coded to the control unit in the car, so unless your using the original key it will need coding.

@ fordfan

marc moke · 30-06-2006, 19:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordfan

5 At the back of the lock is a headless bolt (shear bolt), drill this centrally (use a nut pushed into the hole as a guide) and hammer a good quality interference fit Torx bit into it (Good quality because cheap ones break), get a socket and ratchet onto the bit and unscrew the shear bolt.

Could someone please tell me what size nut I'll need for this.

thanks in advance.

m.

fordfan · 30-06-2006, 20:17

Probably a 8 to 10mm , it just sits in the hole to act as a guide.

familyskodaman · 04-07-2006, 14:22

for info of anyone with same problem-

i didn't need to code the new keys, i just took the chip out the old key and put into the new one. Easy enough- held the key with grips and slip a stanley blade down the side of the chip to free it, then prised out with a screwdriver, came out easy and works fine.

Andy.

29-06-2006, 13:33	#1
familyskodaman Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 7 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Fitting new ignition lock - need some advice... Hi, I got in my Felicia estate yesterday and the key wouldn't go into the ignition properly. So I took apart the cowling etc and in the end I smashed the ignition barrel casing off, removed the steering lock bar and barrel. I'm running it fine holding the key next to the transponder and turning the ignition switch without barrel, but it's not so good if the taped up switch fell apart when my wife has the car..! So I'd like to ask some advice before i replace the lock and find it doesn't work. I'm thinking my best bet is a breakers to get a barrel complete with casing (mine is smashed...) from a scrap car (with key) So can anyone help with these questions: 1. Am I right in saying the easiest way to get the casing off the scrap car is to drill through the bolts that bolt it to the steering column?? (The Haynes manual says hit them with a punch to turn them but it doesn't look that easy in reality, hence me smashing it off my own car when I had to get to work and didn't have a spare 4 hours..!) 2. what about the immobiliser?? now here's my thinking (and i hope you can follow it!) - I get the lock and key from the scrap car, then go and get a new key cut to match the scrap key (to fit the scrap lock) but get the immobiliser chip bit copied from my own key (to work my immobiliser) Will this work? or has anyone go any better ideas? (new barrel would be good but I reckon I need to go to the scrappy anyway to get the casing bit as it's likely to be an expensive dealer only part??) Also, if anyone can tell me where to get a cheap new lock set that might come in handy if I don't find one.. One other question: after removing the cowling, unbolting the steering column and removing the barrel etc (and putting it together again) the low brake fluid level light has been on. The brake fluid is fine so I'm guessing I bumped a wire behind the dash?? Thanks for any help ! Andy. Last edited by familyskodaman; 29-06-2006 at 13:38.

30-06-2006, 02:11	#2
marc moke Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... Hi Andy. Sorry I'm going to be of no help to you at all. But the thing is, I have the exact same problem. Well almost. The ignition barrel, in my Felicia (S reg), is jammed, but i have not yet done anything about fixing it. I have ordered a new barrel and key (from skoda, it cost me around £50). But at the moment I'm stuck, with my haynes manuel 100 miles away. So maybe you (or anyone else) could help me. I have little or no knowledge about fixing cars, so please bear with me. But I have help from someone who does. I've been told you have to remove the steering wheel before you can remove the barrel. Is this right? And do I not need a special tool to do this? Beyond that, could anyone just advise me on how to go about replacing the barrel. I will go and get my haynes manual before attempting anything. But any aditional help would be most appreciated. Sorry for hijacking your thread Andy, but it seemed silly to start a new thread on almost the exact topic. But I will remove if its a problem. Marc. Last edited by marc moke; 30-06-2006 at 02:14.

30-06-2006, 07:27	#3
Lummox Hairy Yeti Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Newport Pagnell Posts: 21,160 Thanks: 18 Thanked 538 Times in 470 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... Very common fault on the Felicia this one. You should remove the shear bolts by tapping them around with a chisel or a punch and of course get new ones to replace them with. You idea would work, using a second hand barrel and key and obtaining the security code and reprogramming the immobilizer. You dont need to remove the steering wheel, the top trim will come out if you ease it up, you just need to drop the column so the barrel becomes accessable. Dont loose any wires off the back of the switch though. Might be worth making a picture of what wire goes where before removing them. __________________ MK2 Golf GTi - APX 225bhp 1.8T - Emerald K3 - Quaife ATB - VR6 Widetrack - VR6 brakes front and rear - Neuspeed ARBs - Speedline alloys - H+R coilovers - Powerflex bushes - Helix clutch G60 flywheel - Adjustable solid top mounts - Custom engine bay - Tornado Motorsport MSA cage - and lots lots more.

30-06-2006, 07:37	#4
fordfan ECUless Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,823 Thanks: 28 Thanked 202 Times in 176 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... 1 Disconnect the battery 2 Remove lower column shroud, you should be able to get away with out taking the top one off as you need to remove the steering wheel for this 3 Drop the column, 4 bolts (12mm I think) and make a note of where all the spacers and washers go. 4 Disconnect the electrical plugs for the stalk switches, airbag and horn. 5 At the back of the lock is a headless bolt (shear bolt), drill this centrally (use a nut pushed into the hole as a guide) and hammer a good quality interference fit Torx bit into it (Good quality because cheap ones break), get a socket and ratchet onto the bit and unscrew the shear bolt. 6 Remove the lock, take the switch off (2 grub screws). The car can still be started by passing the key through the read coil and operating the switch with the end of the key. Get a new lock, used ones are likely to have the same problem £60 or so + VAT. The keys will need to be coded which you will need the 4 digit PIN (dealer job), alternatively you could try swapping the transponders in the key, but they are quite well stuck in. Don't re-assemble it and then expect to get the keys coded as 1 It won't start 2 If you do not have the PIN the dealer will require the immobiliser serial number to get it. And of course Lummox beats me to it.

30-06-2006, 09:46	#5
familyskodaman Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 7 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... Hi, thanks for the advice. Yesterday I tried the chisel and hammer to turn the shear bolt and it wasn't for moving. (just took chunks out it and the casing) then tried drilling it but the bolt is much harder than the casing so is difficult to drill. That Torx bit trick and using a nut as a guide for the drill- fantastic advice FordFan, a voice of experience. (I didn't say, but I actually used to work as a mechanic and I'd forgotten that trick) - that's THE way to do it Marc. Skoda can sell you a new barrel with all the mounting casing (right up to where it connects to the column) for £73 all in. So the mounting casing is only £21 which makes it tempting just to smash it (or preferably grind it) off as the casing is so soft. that's probably the way I'll go as I've already damaged the casing a bit. Marc- the job is easy just follow the advice on here (I didnt remove the steering wheel) - only 1 screw under steering wheel then slide the bottom shrowd off (forwards or backwards). Top shrowd should have a screw removed which is just behind the steergin wheel at the top (you could get it with small grips without removing the steering wheel) - i just went for the pull it hard option and broke the plastic (it's gone back on fine) unbolt the 4 bolts under the steering column (yes- 12mm) and slide it down and yes- note where the washers etc go before you lower the column and they drop on the floor and you have to work out how they go... (yes I did that too) You won't need the Haynes manual, nothing in there that isn't posted here really. Getting off the shear bolt is hard though and will take some time. About the immobiliser code- I've had copies of my original key made in the past (in a hardware store) and the guy copied the code from my original key to a new one he supplied and it worked fine. (he only took about £10 and I think he maybe used a vw transponder for the key but I'm not sure) So I guess the cheapest way to do it might be to find a key cutter who can copy the new key that you get with the barrel and also copy the code from your old key. You don't need to bother getting codes etc from Skoda then. Thanks again for your help folks, Andy Last edited by familyskodaman; 30-06-2006 at 09:51.

30-06-2006, 14:36	#6
marc moke Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 3 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... Thanks for the advice everyone. Last edited by marc moke; 30-06-2006 at 14:42.

30-06-2006, 17:51	#7
familyskodaman Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 7 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... ordered new parts from skoda today - turns out the mounting and new sheer bolts are only about £10. thanks Andy

30-06-2006, 20:17	#10
fordfan ECUless Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,823 Thanks: 28 Thanked 202 Times in 176 Posts	Re: fitting new ignition lock need some advice... Probably a 8 to 10mm , it just sits in the hole to act as a guide.

04-07-2006, 14:22	#11
familyskodaman Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 7 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Re: Fitting new ignition lock - need some advice... for info of anyone with same problem- i didn't need to code the new keys, i just took the chip out the old key and put into the new one. Easy enough- held the key with grips and slip a stanley blade down the side of the chip to free it, then prised out with a screwdriver, came out easy and works fine. Andy.

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