Rear Speaker Replacement And Questions...

[MrkyMrk]

I'm gonna disconnect the rear tweeters and want to replace the rear bass units with full range items. I know nothing when it comes to ICE...

1. Can anyone recommend a speaker that will fit right in as a direct replacement without any need for customization.

2. Am I the only person who's rear speakers get splashed when opening the hatch after a downpour? Any protection tips?

3. Do speakers nowadays come with standard connectors? i.e. will I be able to simply unplug the old and plug in the new?

4. How much damage is this DIY doofus gonna do by attempting a self install? Rate the complexity of speaker replacement for me

After this I may try that front door bass trick - any photos in a Hayes stylee would be mucho appreciated!

TIA

Regards,

Mark

[robmawer]

Originally posted by MrkyMrk in this post
1. Can anyone recommend a speaker that will fit right in as a
direct replacement without any need for customization.

I opted for Pioneer TS-G1316 speakers - 30 quid from Halfords,
fitted in perfectly.

2. Am I the only person who's rear speakers get splashed when opening the hatch after a downpour? Any protection tips?

No and no! The Pioneers are waterproof though, and a bit of
bass will shake off any residue...

3. Do speakers nowadays come with standard connectors? i.e. will I be able to simply unplug the old and plug in the new?

4. How much damage is this DIY doofus gonna do by attempting a self install? Rate the complexity of speaker replacement for me

Yes, they do come with standard connectors - two wires! It
depends how you perform the install as to how much damage it
does. Reversibility was an issue for me, so I could put the original
speakers back in for trade-in. The replacement is pretty easy, I'm
pretty clueless about this sort of thing too!

Connected to the rear speaker, you will find two plugs into each
speaker, each with two cables going into them.
One of these plugs will be for the rear speaker, one will be for
the rear tweeter in the door. The best way to determine which
is which is to unplug one and see which speakers still work

Once you've determined which plug is which, you know have a
choice of how much "damage" you are going to do, which
speakers you want connected and how professional you want the
install to look.

One choice is to cut the connectors off, then join the +ves and
put a spade connector on it, and the same for the -ves. This will
keep your rear tweeter's working and look professional, but
putting your old speakers in will be harder.
The spade connector will then plug onto the new speaker unit.
If you want to disable the rear tweeter, then just cut the
connector from plug which "works" the rear speaker and put a
spade connector on each of the wires.

Personally, I didn't bother with this. I wasn't interested in the
rear tweeters working, so I left the connector for this alone.
The Pioneers come with some cables with spades on one end,
which can be put on the speaker. I then cut the cable down and
stripped the end. I then took the exposed wires and slipped
them into the rear speaker connector using a pointy screw
(+ve to +ve and -ve to -ve). This was then bound with masking
tape to keep it steady...

Screwing the speakers into position is pretty straightforward and
probably doesn't need explaining. The one at the front of the
speaker and nearest the panel is a fiddly one though!


Hope this helps, feel free to ask questions if any of it is a bit
confusing!


Rob.

[MrkyMrk]

Thanks for that. Were those Pioneers "full range"?

I've disconnected those rear tweeters and it does make a positive difference. I'm surprised at the freqency range of the rears sans tweeters. The very top end is obviously limited but there's a lot more mid-high frequency information being transmitted than I thought there would be. I might live with what's there, to be honest.

I should have looked into it before blasting out the questions

I'm still a little concerned about how it will sound for the nippers in the back. I know my eldest (4) likes her music in the car (Avril Lavigne is her thing right now!) so we'll see how it goes. A change to full range may yet be on the cards.

I popped out to the local car audio place this lunchtime. The guy there was surprised at what the rears managed to produce given their diminutive size. He thought replacing them would yeild little benefit as far as output capability was concerned, but the issue of not having tweeters for the rears is a factor.

Another thing he said this time regarding front speakers was that he would not recommend cutting into that membrane, especially in a new car. The risk of damage, however small, would not be outweighed by the improvement in sound quality in his opinion. Only one way to go to get more bass - add a sub...

He almost sold me a removable Kenwood tube and would have done if it hadn't been for the SO

As it happens I just ended up spending almost 700 quid on a VEBA DVD system in a bag...

Regards,

Mark

[robmawer]

Originally posted by MrkyMrk in this post
I've disconnected those rear tweeters and it does make a positive difference. I'm surprised at the freqency range of the rears sans tweeters. The very top end is obviously limited but there's a lot more mid-high frequency information being transmitted than I thought there would be. I might live with what's there, to be honest.

Well, the way it worked for me was that, one bored Saturday
morning, I thought I'd try unplugging the rear tweeters. Much
impressed with the lack of ear irritating noise, but couldn't really
hear the backs - much like driving a 2 speaker car. So I decided
to get some rear speakers that would have a greater noise
efficiency (to match the Infinity's in the fronts), and also to create
some treble in the back.

If I recall correctly, the standard rear speaker is a W-cone,
whereas the Pioneer one has a composite tweeter in it, which
fitted the bill perfectly...

Glad you asked the questions anyway, I'm sure the answers
will be of benefit to future generations anyway!

Only one way to go to get more bass - add a sub...

...almost sold me a removable Kenwood tube...

Based on this, who are you going to believe...someone who
makes a living selling car audio, or your friendly non-profit Skoda resource...

Do tell us more about the DVD thing though - you're not the only
one interested in this so it might be of benefit to others!


Rob.

[fen_l&k]

Originally posted by MrkyMrk in this post
Another thing he said this time regarding front speakers was that he would not recommend cutting into that membrane, especially in a new car. The risk of damage, however small, would not be outweighed by the improvement in sound quality in his opinion. Only one way to go to get more bass - add a sub...

My biggest problem is not more bass - just getting rid of the distorted bwww bwww bwww you get from the fronts.

Rob, I assume you also got rid of that carpet nonsense around the rears?

I'll give the rear tweeter thing a go and see if I can get some pics at the same time (might even be a chance to try out the macro setting on the camera).

Howard

[MrkyMrk]

I'm afraid I'm gonna play safe and not whip the stanley knife out to a car with 750 miles on the clock...

Did you think the Pioneers were worth the outlay? With not doing that front door hack, the majority of my bass is from those tiny rear units. Would I be sacrificing that going for the £30 replacements? That is, have you noticed any reduction in bass levels from the rear having replaced the standard fit items?

I'll pick up the DVD wotsit tomorrow - only had the small 4:3 screen version in store. I'll let you know how it pans out. It will get thoroughly tested when we go to Germany in a couple of weeks...

Regards,

Mark

[robmawer]

Originally posted by fen_l&k in this post
My biggest problem is not more bass - just getting rid of the distorted bwww bwww bwww you get from the fronts.

Rob, I assume you also got rid of that carpet nonsense around the rears?

Poverty spec, mate...we don't get no fancy carpeted speakers.
Would advise pulling those off though, I'd imagine it would
muffle things...

Are you still running the original fronts? Upgrading those to
a non-paper cones will help stop it distorting, and also improve
the audibility of the mid and bass frequencies...


Rob.

[MrkyMrk]

Just thought, in the meantime here is some info...

The screen:
http://www.veba.uk.com/products/prod...s_av700ams.htm

The player:
http://www.veba.uk.com/products/products_dvd_AV2402.htm

The entire kit:
http://www.veba.uk.com/products/prod...ss_dvdkits.htm

Regards,

Mark

[MrkyMrk]

I don't get any buzziness, just not a great deal of depth. Need to fill out the bottom with those tiny rears!!

Regards,

Mark

[robmawer]

Originally posted by MrkyMrk in this post
Did you think the Pioneers were worth the outlay? With not doing that front door hack, the majority of my bass is from those tiny rear units. Would I be sacrificing that going for the £30 replacements? That is, have you noticed any reduction in bass levels from the rear having replaced the standard fit items?

Well, it's 30 quid...which considering you've just bought a vRS,
680 quidsworth of DVD equipment and are going on holiday,
I'd imagine is not a huge amount for you to risk. Or maybe after
all that it's all you have left...
Anyway, I digress...

The Pioneers are definitely better than the standards - I think
they would be though, as the standards would not cost anywhere
near 30 quid! Bass is much improved - for reference I tend to
use Jamiroquai, and you get a very nice clean bass with this.
With dance tracks I tend to put the balance +1 or 2 to the rear,
and this gives a nice pseduo-sub rumble...

The improvement was much noticeable though - since getting
them fitted (and I mean, even on the day), people do sing in
the back of the car now, which I guess means they can actually
hear the music.
Note this may not be desirable for everyone...


Rob.

[devonutopia]

I love my system. Would not want to change anything at all really. If I got it any louder, or more bassier (is that a word?) - I'd be worried about my wingmirror glass cracking, the way it shakes already when something bass-ey plays.

I did get a problem with "bwww bwww bwww bwww" from the front left, but I got it changed on warranty and have had no problems since. I think it blew when my mate tried to play the system WAY too loud on a pub-crawl/pub-drive.

[robmawer]

Oh, yes, good point there Jason - if it's a proper loud farty distortion as opposed to the usual
buzzing or humming, then chances are you've got a popped cone.

Which should be replaced under warranty from the dealer. Think I lost about 3 in as many
months until I upgraded...


Rob.

[fen_l&k]

I think I may just head for the upgrade route, given that they are just going to put the same POS speakers back in anyway.

Funny thing is, the L&K is supposed to have an 'upgraded' sound system.

HA!

Hate to hear the 'downgraded' one.

So, it will be new fronts and rears for me then.

Off to convince the other half.............

Cheers all,

H

[robmawer]

Originally posted by fen_l&k in this post

Off to convince the other half.............

I didn't bother, just went ahead and did it and she didn't notice.
But then, what do you expect from a gender that purposefully
grows hair to cover their ears?


Rob.

[devonutopia]

*and then spend loads of time constantly pushing it behind their ears, for it to fall back over, 10 seconds later. Just at excuse to preen, I reckon

Anyway, what was this thread talking about again? Oh, yeah - speakers

[fen_l&k]

I'm doing well so far - spoke to her about the Swissol stuff and she seemed keen - even after telling her the price.

I'm going for the "well I spend so much time in the car" angle I think.

On a roll...

[SkodiRS]

Replaced my front speakers but haven't cut the plastic membrane; did experience some bass buzz when I initially did the install but don't get it now. Maybe the speakers needed bedding in?

Disconnected the rear tweeters; there is an improvement at higher volumes but at lower levels it's a bit quiet. Nipper said he can't hear the music.

I feel that if you are installing a DVD system it is probably worth leaving the tweeters connected in the interest of sound staging(??) i.e. I don't whether it would enhance watching DVDs with the sound coming from behind the watchers ears (the main reason why the tweeter was removed i the first place from a drivers point of view).

Just MHO.
Cheers.
Adrian.

[robmawer]

The DVD screens usually have their own screens or work off headphones...

On the subject though, I am a bit curious about the "independent front and rear
audio controls" on the new Vauxhall Meriva. Of course I'm extremely curious to
what level the independency is carried, if it's just volume, bass, etc. or you can
actually have different music. Being Vauxhall though, their advert doesn't
actually tell you anything useful like this, it just shows a car driving around in half
for 30 seconds.


Rob.

[MrkyMrk]

The DVD-in-a-bag system comes with both headphones and a rudimentary speaker in the screen. Fit for purpose - entertaining the 4 year old. Soundstaging? I think I'll forego the 6.1 DD EX / DTS ES...

Seriously, tho, I know what you mean and it had crossed my mind. If it's gonna go thru the main system (probably have to do it with one of those headphone-to-tape-in-car-CD adapter thingys) I might just bias the sound to the front.

I'm sold on those Pioneers, tho. Trip to Halfords this week methinks

Regards,

Mark

[MrkyMrk]

Well, it's 30 quid...which considering you've just bought a vRS,
680 quidsworth of DVD equipment and are going on holiday,
I'd imagine is not a huge amount for you to risk. Or maybe after
all that it's all you have left...

LOL

It was more the risk of me making a complete mess (easy done, for me - it took a lot of courage for me just to undo those tweeter plugs!) and the subsequent "proper" install costs to fix up my mess, but I'll take the deep breath and give it a whirl.

Car maintenance on any aspect over and above checking oil/tyres/windscreen washer and cleaning duties fills me with dread...

So I'm a wuss...

Regards,

Mark