Terrorist Set Free

[pittVRS]

Osama Bin Laden's European "Right Hand Man" has won his fight against being deported from Britain and has been released from jail.

Wishy Washy, Cardigan wearing, Yoghurt Swilling, Guardian Reading Proffessional Lying Hypocrite Jacqui Smith is described as being "disappointed" at the judges decision to release him.

Disappointed? She should be F***ing Furious! The judge that signed the release papers should be arrested for high treason.

The Human Rights Act is a noble whimsical piece of legislation that is fatally flawed. It would be fine if we lived in a utopia, but sadly we don't. the world just doesn't work like that and the ideals that it sets out will never be achieved as long as the human race roams the earth. We need something much more realistic which protects decent people against criminals, and not the other way round!

BBC NEWS | UK | Abu Qatada released from prison

[anonymouse]

Couldn't agree more - crazy crazy crazy

Abu Qatada is banned from having guests other than family and solicitors.
Among the people he is banned from meeting in London is al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden.
Others include bin Laden's deputy Ayman al-Zawahiri and Rachid Ramda, who has been convicted in France of masterminding a series of bombings in 1995.
Also named is hate preacher Abu Hamza.

Are they for real !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[swedishskoda]

I guess that the court decision is in accordance with English law? In that case I think one should be grateful that judges still stick to these guidelines and nothing else. How anyone could call that "high treason" is beyond my understanding?

If our Western/European superior attitude towards "the lesser breeds without the law" is ever justified it is just because of the stress we (used to) put on the rule of law as a cornerstone of a civilised society.

OK; the guy is convicted, but a conviction in a Jordan court should probably be treated with a certain amount of caution. Don't know about the chances for a fair trial there, probably better than in many other countries in the Middle East, but nevertheless something I wouldn't place a bet on.

[Basil]

I think a special law should be introduced for anyone proven involved in misguiding angry young people and leading to acts of senseless violence.
People like that are dangerous - they believe that violence is rewarded, and brainwash others into believing it.
You don't release a psychopath who uses an axe on people back home. And how much will his "care" cost in tax money??
I really hate stupid people like that - when will they ever realise that we are all the same under the skin.
They actively contribute to a hell on earth and then expect heaven afterwards? Boy are they in for a surprise one day.....

[swedishskoda]

Originally Posted by Basil

I think a special law should be introduced for anyone proven involved in misguiding angry young people and leading to acts of senseless violence.

If present laws dealing with cases of "aiding and abetting" are insufficient (and they might be), OK. But courts' decisions must not be based on hypothetical laws that might be needed, a court can only rule by the laws that have been passed by Parliament.

[Basil]

The fact that such a person was essentially released speaks for itself.

[swedishskoda]

Originally Posted by Basil

The fact that such a person was essentially released speaks for itself.

Does it, really? Unless he has committed a crime under English law (or a crime in another country to which he can be extradicted according to the principles of international law), his character, viewpoints and so on is of no importance whatsoever - of course he should be "released". He is, after all, subjected to pretty severe restrictions. BTW I found this one highly reassuring:

"Among the people he is banned from meeting in London is al Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden."

OK, with the disgraceful anti-terrorism laws the old Habeas Corpus writ is not worth as much as it used to be, but that courts refuse to follow the Bush/Blair jurisprudence to its extremes deserves praise IMHO.

And yes, right now I'm probably a bit more edgy than usual on Human Rights matters since our own Parliament is on the verge to pass a law giving Swedish GCHQ the right to surveillance and archiving of all telephone, cellphone, email traffic crossing the Swedish borders

[Babs]

Just f*cking shoot him!

[swedishskoda]

Originally Posted by Babs

Just f*cking shoot him!

Very constructive.

Maybe Basil is right after all - a "special law for anyone proven involved in misguiding angry young people and leading to acts of senseless violence" could be a good thing.

[symonevans]

Well ''set free". Not quite.

If you can class being tagged and having to spend 22hours inside "set free" then hmmmmmm.

Personally I think they should deport him out of the country and keep tight monitoring on his movements and not let him near Europe. The states can do what they want IMO

[cheezemonkhai]

Originally Posted by swedishskoda

Does it, really? Unless he has committed a crime under English law (or a crime in another country to which he can be extradited according to the principles of international law), his character, viewpoints and so on is of no importance whatsoever - of course he should be "released". He is, after all, subjected to pretty severe restrictions. BTW I found this one highly reassuring:

He has committed things that were offences under English Law until the Human Rights Act came in. There should be a human rights act, but this shouldn't be it!

Wonder if somebody will now be radicalised by local him haters (who seem to be protected by this law) and then go and suicide bomb his car/house?

Sorry, but this guy should be in Jordan right now.

[Babs]

Originally Posted by swedishskoda

Very constructive.

Maybe Basil is right after all - a "special law for anyone proven involved in misguiding angry young people and leading to acts of senseless violence" could be a good thing.

It's not senseless though, is it?

I'm fed up with having to pay taxes to keep scum like this alive, behind bars. He's a waste of oxygen

[Basil]

It could be argued that any organised violence, however cleverly justified on a logical or emotional level is indeed senseless.

If you have a hate problem, you should seek counselling, not encourage young people seeking a meaning in life to throw it all away.

Violence has no place in any religious belief.

(I'll get off this soap box now,lol....)

[gadgetman]

Bad news yes, BUT he'll have MI6 all over his **** forever.

They may also be hoping some converts may try to make contact with him through his family.

How do we know this isnt actually a staged plan to catch others?

[pittVRS]

Originally Posted by swedishskoda

I guess that the court decision is in accordance with English law? In that case I think one should be grateful that judges still stick to these guidelines and nothing else. How anyone could call that "high treason" is beyond my understanding?

If our Western/European superior attitude towards "the lesser breeds without the law" is ever justified it is just because of the stress we (used to) put on the rule of law as a cornerstone of a civilised society.

The rule of law is not something that is set in stone it is a constantly changing and developing complex quagmire. The way a case goes in the appeal courts often depends on how effective and convincing each barrister's argument is. The most eloquent and persuasive argument usually wins and the judge will base his interpretation of the law on that argument. this is a simplified view of proceedings as Judges often favour barristers that work in chambers that the judge used to work for, and the Old Boys Network is very much alive and well in the Barr.

Each Judge will make a ruling based on their own interpretation of the law and that will then stand as case law until another similar case comes along and another judge makes a different interpretation of the same law and the decision is overturned. So it's not a case of "the law is the law and the judges stick to the guidlines" Most of these high court judges are in their 70's and 80's and have not got a clue of how life is lived by ordinary people. I for one think that they should be a lot more accountable and their decisions should be open to scrutiny. There have been cases where judges have fallen asleep during the trial,cut closing arguments short so that they can go off to dinner and made blatantly incompetent decisions on important test cases.

As for treason, this man has openly talked of his hatred for the west and called for attacks in Britain. By releasing him from prison, the judge has made it much easier for this man to carry out his desires. Bail conditions get broken very very easily.

OK; the guy is convicted, but a conviction in a Jordan court should probably be treated with a certain amount of caution. Don't know about the chances for a fair trial there, probably better than in many other countries in the Middle East, but nevertheless something I wouldn't place a bet on.

I think he would get a very fair trial in Jordan. Shariah law is a very competent legal system and one which we westerners could learn a lot from. Just because he faces the death penalty is no reason to let him be a fugitive in England for the rest of his days, he should be deported immediately to answer for his crimes.

[Basil]

You know what it truly funny - you read up on the English courts in the 16th century - Judge would just hang anyone they felt like - for petty crimes such as stealing even.

Perhaps it's not evolution of the legal system, just swinging too far off to protecting individual rights at the expense of society's rights.....

What a total mess.....

[swedishskoda]

Originally Posted by Basil

...just swinging too far off to protecting individual rights at the expense of society's rights.....

I don't accept the idea that "society" can be separated from the individuals that constitute it. Consequently, the society as some kind of mysterious autonomous body cannot have any rights at the expense of the individuals'. Society's institutional rights are dependent on the said institiutions capability of protecting individual rights.

[Captain Sisko]

Yes she was "let out" of the big brother house apparantly after gangster comments

oops wrong terrorist.

Ehy dont they just deport him? surely if he diesnt care about other peoples human rights why do people care about his? (besides getting money to fight on his behalf)

[KLM]

I'm sure that if someone is really percieved as that much of a threat to national security then they will be dealt with/removed in other ways other than the court system. We don't have some of the words best intellegence services and stealth fighting forces just to sit around all day playing tiddleywinks. We may not know what they do but the fact they are very much there means that they must be used for something.

While I agree that he should not have been released the judge can only go with what the law says. Judges can't just do as they wish they have to work to what laws have been laid down by the government. The judge may not have wanted to release him but had no choice.

MI5 MI6 SAS etc however probably have much 'looser' rules to work to.

[cheezemonkhai]

Oh look Radiation poisoning, who would have thought it