Hopefully will be going to look at a 2.5 V6 Superb tomorrow. Now I know the 1.9 TDi unit are pretty robust, but I don't know a great deal about the 2.5 V6 unit. I've read bad reports about them, but good ones too. It's on a 03 with 85k on the clock. Is there anything to look out for, or that should of been done at that mileage? What are the cambelt change intervals?

I would prefer a 1.9TDi 130, but for the money I've got its either poor spec or ex taxi mileage! And as I'll be towing a caravan that 2.5 V6 will be more than capable! Would appreciate and advice or comments. Thanks

Don't do it.

The V6 is an old tech engine (inefficient and high tax) with a flaky Bosch VP44 fuel pump and very high maintenance costs (check the cost of changing all the engine belts and idlers + water pump). Compare the engine outputs, fuel consumption and - above all - tax with the 1.9 PD.

At the present cost of fuel, find a good 130 HP 1.9 PD engine. The 2.0 PD engines self-destruct.

I tow a very heavy trailer with my 130PD - no problems at all. The lousy handling of the Superb is made even worse by the weight of the V6.

rotodiesel.

Thanks for the reply. Seems like the hunt is back on for a 1.9 TDi then :/

Good advice once again from the AntiVag League

I agree the 1.9 TDi is the best of the bunch. I now realise that I'd have been better buying a 1.9 Edition 100 but I bought a 2.5TDi Elegance instead. It is a 55 plate and have done about 74k miles with no mechanical issues. I commute from Cheshire to Surrey Monday and Fridays and every week it returns just over 48mpg measured brim to brim. The cam belt needs changing every 4 years just like all VAG diesel engines and it will cost about £100 more to change on a 2.5 compared to a 1.9. That's £25 per year, less than 50p a week. If you find a good 2.5TDi don't be put off, it is a very good motor car but suffers from the poor electrics and water ingress issues of all B5 platform vehicles.

Correction to the above post - VAG UK say the cambelt needs changing every 4 years. Read the service book which comes with the vehicle.

Only VAG could use fear as a revenue earning tactic.

rotodiesel.

On the motorway the 2.5 tdi is lovely. Torque comes in a lot sooner than on the 1.9 and lasts much longer into the rev range.

Economy is not too different on the motorway particularly at higher speeds.

I regularly get 45mpg on the motorway (mine is auto too!).

Round town though the V6 will be thirsty, 25 mpg ish.

Maintenance costs are not too different from the 1.9 tdi.

Consider the cost of a new camshaft on the 1.9 tdi (they do wear out) at £500 or the cost of one injector at £700 and all of a sudden the price of a new VP44 for the 2.5 tdi at £1000 is not that expensive!

Check that all glow plugs work, as this cost me loads of money due to a written off cylinder head. And go for the manual box.

Correction to the above post - VAG UK say the cambelt needs changing every 4 years. Read the service book which comes with the vehicle.

Only VAG could use fear as a revenue earning tactic.

rotodiesel.

I have read it and you are right.

Re - Glowplugs. I had all 6 changed recently at a main dealer and it was £200. Not a bad idea to change them out on a car more than 5 years old. One of mine had gone completely with two more that were suspect.

As you can easily test a glowplug in-situ, there's not a lot of point in changing them all. They're a bit like light bulbs in that the odd one will often last a long time.

I regularly see 1.9 PD engines with starship mileages on them - camshaft failure does occur (usually on the 150 PS version which was never fitted to the Superb) but this is usually due to the use of the wrong oil. I can't recall ever seeing a V6 diesel running for much over 100k miles without major attention.

The VED tax on the V6 is disproportionate relative to its increased output. In other words, it's old tech.

rotodiesel.

I can't recall ever seeing a V6 diesel running for much over 100k miles without major attention.

rotodiesel.

Ummm .. when you say "major attention", what are the things that need doing in general. I know about cam belts costs, water ingress, maybe the fuel pump, but apart from that am not really aware of anything else. The early engines hit camshaft problems I believe, but I'm told that any engine after about 2003 had the fix for that so am really expecting my 2.5 V6 to go round the clock a couple of times if need be.

Fuel pumps are the main problem - any engine with a VP44 (Google) is grief. GM/SAAB have not had a happy time with it. Putting electronics inside a diesel pump on an engine is plain stupid.

Consequential problems arising from cambelt changes are another problem - it's a complex procedure and getting the basic timing correct involves (or should involve) several trials of assembly and reassembly. The dealers have nothing like the skills necessary to make a proper job of it. Many engines which have had belts changed by a dealer have been incorrectly timed and some have given trouble afterwards. The water pump has a ridiculous radial load on its bearing and has a life to match.

I'd have a bit more time for the V6 diesel if VAG had given it a taller top gear relative to the 1.9 - but they didn't. It uses the same transmission and is consequently under geared. Any advantage that its higher torque could give is consequently lost.

Not a fan of this engine.

rotodiesel.

Fuel pumps are the main problem - any engine with a VP44 (Google) is grief. GM/SAAB have not had a happy time with it. Putting electronics inside a diesel pump on an engine is plain stupid.

Consequential problems arising from cambelt changes are another problem - it's a complex procedure and getting the basic timing correct involves (or should involve) several trials of assembly and reassembly. The dealers have nothing like the skills necessary to make a proper job of it. Many engines which have had belts changed by a dealer have been incorrectly timed and some have given trouble afterwards. The water pump has a ridiculous radial load on its bearing and has a life to match.

I'd have a bit more time for the V6 diesel if VAG had given it a taller top gear relative to the 1.9 - but they didn't. It uses the same transmission and is consequently under geared. Any advantage that its higher torque could give is consequently lost.

Not a fan of this engine.

rotodiesel.

Listen to Roto, many ppl who have one will pull you down ito the pit, there is only one Superb to own and it's 4 cyl and 1.9 in CC.

Guys

Do you want to buy 2.5TDIs on the cheap? Because that's how all these posts flaming 2.5TDI sound, to discourage other potential buyers :p .

Yes, it is old tech, but as a used car you have to pay double for comparable comfort/power from anyone else, including VW. As a new car, the Superbs were undercutting Audi A6 by 40%+ for comparable equipment/interior/drive quality. I test drove both Superb 2.5TDI and A6 3.0TDI in 2006 and decided that 4WD and a bit more power was not worth extra £16k and 40% higher running costs (tyres, brakes etc.). At least the Superb equipped with insulated glass is as quiet and as comfortable as the A6 from the same period.

Also, being old tech is not neccessarily bad, these engines are more fuel tolerant than the CR/PD bunch. While VP44 is more prone to faults than VP37, it really does not seem to fall apart at every corner, does it? I am talking about VWs not GM/SAABs which have different engine layout/design, possibly overheating the pump (or damaging electrics due to vibration). Plus in a lot of GM vehicles VP44 works with 2x fuel flow of the 2.5TDI which must account for extra stress/failures.

There is good evidence from every diesel engine make that at least some workshops are talking the customers into replacing injection pump whenever there is any hard starting or stutter problem (instead of replacing glow plugs, fuel filter, or MAF). A friend of mine has had the very experience (GM car), replacing 4 glow plugs fixed the problem...

I have the 2.5TDI, and while admittedly the TB job was a dog (did it myself), if you do it more than once and follow factory manual, it is not much more complicated than the 1,9TDI. The access to belt drive is quite good thanks to the moveable front, you can look at belt drive and compare to instructions, I cannot say the same about my Octavia. Basic timing setting requires loosening and tightening of 3 screws on camshaft wheel, while it is very sensitive, it is possible to get it to desired setting (to within 0.2deg!) in under 3 attempts. One problem I did see with the 2.5TDI is galvanic corossion, but it is easily addressable with a can of zinc spray in under 10mins.

Yes, the gearbox could be longer geared, but it does have a benefit - you can cruise around town in 3rd or 4th pretty much like in an automatic. There is plenty of torque from <1000rpm to 4000rpm (4:1) and the engine is very smooth. The comparable numbers for 1.9 would be about 1500 - 3500rpm (2.3:1). Plus I think you will find accelerating at sub-1800rpm quite unpleasant in the 1.9tdi due to vibration. You can cruise all day in the Superb at sub-1300rpm, it really uses little fuel then.

If you really need longer gearing and want to save fuel, there is a way. There are 195/65/16 tyres available which fit in the wheel wells and even as a spare (at a push), and these will give you 5% longer gearing, and corresponding fuel saving at top end (actually even more saving thanks to lower rolling resistance). I'm seriously considering this now.

5% does not sound much, but at top end this is exactly what's needed to match engine's top power to top speed.

In the last 4 years, my 2.5TDI did 85k miles, and no problems with drivetrain so far, apart from 1 CV boot I had to replace, that I personally had damaged during suspension upgrade . Over half of this 95k was at speeds of 120mph and above across Europe (night drives across Germany). Try doing this with 1.9 for more than 3 years... I did in the Octavia and I would not go to 4-cyl diesel unless I have no choice. I am hoping for another 4-8 years / 160k-240k total motorway miles and then 4 more as a shopping trolley (unless everyone drives electric milk floats by then )

On a side note, at least 15k of my car's mileage is on roads of so poor quality that you will find it hard to match even in the furthest UK backwater (perhaps Ireland may have some comparable roads). I ordered the car with offroad package and after 4 years even this barely survives - I have just spend Saturday morning epoxying and recoating the HD plastic/fibre skid plate because it did look on the brink of collapse at the next knock. If the car survives till 8th birthday, it is getting new protective plates and rear wheel well liners

I quite like the thought of driving 3.0TDI Quattro and I would have retired the Superb from high speed pursuit duty :p earlier (as in this or next year), but Audi in their infinite wisdom took out the full size spare wheel well and downsized fuel tank on the A6 from 80l to 65l... Thank you Audi, the money stays in the pocket and some also goes towards Superb's long term wellbeing.

I can see how 1.9 fares better at motorway ride at constant 70mph, but 2.5TDI at that speed is also quite efficient, the trouble is most people owning 2.5TDI out of choice prefer to travel a tad faster :-)

Makes sense, I haven't done the same milage in mine yet, 74k in 5 years but I manage over 48mpg (measured properly) when commuting M40/M42/M6 at around 70mph.

In the UK there is a blanket 70 mph speed limit.

Remind me of the VED rates for the V6 engine - I've forgotten. (The 1.9 is about £150 per annum). You pay a huge amount in tax, insurance, fuel and maintenance for about a 10 BHP gain.

rotodiesel.

Some of us drive regularly in and outside UK, plus last time I drove on the UK motorway (this morning) most people were driving 80-90mph on the A1 - despite fuel prices...

I pay £85 more per year (£235 total) in additional road tax.

In the same year, I burn £3500+ in fuel, and spend additional £500 on tyres and brakes. The increase in road tax is under 2% of total spend, and the drive comfort is many times that of 1.9TDI, plus 1.9TDI is far less refined even at 70mph motorway cruise.

Stock power difference (163bhp vs 130bhp) is actually 33bhp, or 25% more than the 1.9. This makes all the difference above 90mph.

I agree that for low to moderate mileage and low speed drivers 1.9TDI might be better, but then why not buy cheap petrol Superb or the crazy 2.8V6 (for performance)? Even more savings in purchase price...

I had a 2.5V6 Diesel manual for about 3.5 years. Had quite a few mods done to it at never had a problem with it in that time. It had 90k on the clock when I traded on.

It was an excellent car and would not be put off buying one. If you see one at the right price with all its history intact, Id recommend going for it

Seems its 6 of one and half a dozen of another with opinions on this! I think for the type of driving I'll be doing, and for reliability, and a little extra fuel economy the 1.9 130bhp lump seems the better choice for me. Although that said, if a decent V6 TDi comes along at the right price, mileage, spec and condition I wouldn't turn my nose up at it. As the one I started the thread about for, has no s/h or record of the cambelt being done, and it's on 85k! Originially I was after a Mondeo or Vectra (CDTi 150 unit), but I've always liked the superb, VW quality and reliability, it's a nice big car, similar size to the A6 but without the price tag, and being 6'7ft I tend to decapitate the legs of anyone sitting behind me in most cars, but on the superb there was still reasonable space for passengers. Just getting bored of searching and waiting for a decent one under £4k to turn up, they seem few and far between!

Seems its 6 of one and half a dozen of another with opinions on this! I think for the type of driving I'll be doing, and for reliability, and a little extra fuel economy the 1.9 130bhp lump seems the better choice for me. Although that said, if a decent V6 TDi comes along at the right price, mileage, spec and condition I wouldn't turn my nose up at it. As the one I started the thread about for, has no s/h or record of the cambelt being done, and it's on 85k! Originially I was after a Mondeo or Vectra (CDTi 150 unit), but I've always liked the superb, VW quality and reliability, it's a nice big car, similar size to the A6 but without the price tag, and being 6'7ft I tend to decapitate the legs of anyone sitting behind me in most cars, but on the superb there was still reasonable space for passengers. Just getting bored of searching and waiting for a decent one under £4k to turn up, they seem few and far between!

Don't buy the Mondeo with the diesel engine!!!!

Yeah hence why I don't want a mondeo with diesel anymore, heard many many horror stories, DMF, Injectors, Fuel pump, glow plugs, the list is endless of common problems with them!

On my Mondeo TDi, the camshaft snapped into three pieces and wrote the top end of the engine off.

I have a 2007 V6 TDI with only 50 kms (30k miles) on it, one of the last of the series 1. It is a beautiful car, the engine is smooth and pulls like a freight train from 1200rpm, ride is a little soft but wonderfully smooth and refined. The transmission is the only critism I would have and echo some of the comments from others on this thread. It just doesn't seem to be the right match to the power of the engine. Contrary to a lot of negative comments about this engine I have found a lot of positive stuff. The service manager at my local agent speaks very highly of them. Mine is the last of them though so it may have a lot of the earlier niggles engineered out

I have a 2007 V6 TDI with only 50 kms (30k miles) on it, one of the last of the series 1. It is a beautiful car, the engine is smooth and pulls like a freight train from 1200rpm, ride is a little soft but wonderfully smooth and refined. The transmission is the only critism I would have and echo some of the comments from others on this thread. It just doesn't seem to be the right match to the power of the engine. Contrary to a lot of negative comments about this engine I have found a lot of positive stuff. The service manager at my local agent speaks very highly of them. Mine is the last of them though so it may have a lot of the earlier niggles engineered out

Yours hsould be just fine for many many miles. I remember someone on this forum writing that he worked in a VW workshop for many years and never ever seen a failed 2.5 tdi. They are over engineered, and hence heavy and a bit thirsty but hey the best things in life are not cheap. Camshafts were really the only gripe with these engines mechanically speaking, and that was ironed out at the end of 2001.

I have done 24k miles in exactly one year since I got it, not missed a beat. Enjoy it.

Hi,

 

can an anyone recommend a really trustworthy, extremely knowledgeable and helpfully inexpensive Skoda specialist? in the southeast would be best but not fussed about getting the old beast on the back of a truck if needs be...

 

i have a 2005 100 edition 2.5 superb that has a starting issue. If the car isn’t used for more than 10 hours it won’t start properly...just chugs away. Will eventually start after a lot of smoke and 10-20 attempts. I have a new battery. Could this be to do with the fuel pump? The smoke would indicate that the fuel Is getting pumped to the engine...right?

‘Is there a forum or site where I can upload a video of me starting the car and get feedback. Max file is 10 mb for this site....

 

cheers,

 

J