Just watching winter road rescue, and seeing all the stuck and crashed cars in situations that my car has handled easily with winter Tyres on, why is it people are still having issues with insurance companies? Surely they work on statistics, and winter Tyres are way safer, yet there are no discounts, and some refusals or increases!!! I'm I being stupid? Doesn't a lower risk equate to less payouts by the insurance companies? WHY arnt those of us with proper winters driving around the stuck range rovers with summers on and past all the numerous accidents given a discount? Surely this would encourage more people to fit suitable Tyres and reduce accident rates? They just stated figures of 4,000 accidents due to the weather, and 'not suitable' Tyres.... Why arnt insurance comLanier actively promoting winters?

My insurance company simply said ' as long as they are skoda approved fitment, you don't need to notify us, and no change'

It annoys me. I've actively taken steps to significantly reduce my risk, but am ignored by my insurance company. Since when has less risk equalled no discount?

Rant over ( answers appreciated)

My insurance company - admiral - said I didn't need to tell them about the tyres, it was the steelies they had an issue with so dealt with them as a modification. I told them they were skoda approved size/spec, but still a mod apparently!

My insurance company - admiral - said I didn't need to tell them about the tyres, it was the steelies they had an issue with so dealt with them as a modification. I told them they were skoda approved size/spec, but still a mod apparently!

I've dealt with Admiral twice with winters on steels, both times they didn't care, except to tell them when they go on and off. Yes, I said they were on steel wheels.

And yes, its frustrating that they don't promote winter tyres. They make such a difference when it matters. The only times I get stuck is when theres no room to get around those who can't move. Or my car bottoms out in deep snow.

Perhaps the statistics do not match up.. eg do they actually show that winter tyres prevent claims?

Looking at it another way, a driver with winter tyres fitted could be over confident and be more likely to claim.

Food for thought.

Ollie

Sky Insurance

Tel: 01707 642552

http://www.skyinsurance.co.uk/car-club-insurance.html

And that is what you are up against, people who haven’t used them making the rules

And that is what you are up against, people who haven’t used them making the rules

Are you referring to my post Gizmo?

Yes, if you had used them then surely you would not come out with such a comment:

Perhaps the statistics do not match up.. eg do they actually show that winter tyres prevent claims?

Yes, if you had used them then surely you would not come out with such a comment:

I have them fitted to my partner's vehicle which I drive on a regular basis.

With respect, I stick by my statement and for what it is worth, I make no rules.

Thanks

Ollie

Edited 27 February, 201313 yr by SkyInsurance

So having personally used them can you honestly say they offer no better grip than ‘normal’ tyres??

The comment about making the rules was not directly to you but the insurance industry as a whole, maybe if the industry stepped back and saw that motorists were going to the extra hassle of running the appropriate tyres for the conditions and offered an incentive then more people would use them, resulting in less accidents in the winter*

* You will always get someone driving like an arse no matter what tyres they have fitted, but from my experience those that have invested in another set of tyres that are more suitable for the conditions tend to have a more sensible approach towards driving. , so are likely to be less of a risk to the insurers.

I think the issue may be with the people who put them on and still think they can corner at 50mph on snow. Though I imagine they learn the truth pretty quickly, so shouldn't really be a problem.

So having personally used them can you honestly say they offer no better grip than ‘normal’ tyres??

That isn't what I am saying at all. Please re-read my wording.

Indirectly you are claiming that a car with winter tyres on is no safer than one without, as they will be over confident.

Of course a car with winter tyres car will be travelling faster than a car not fitted with them, this is simply due to the lack of grip available to the car without the winter tyres.

The import thing is a car on winter tyres travelling at 30mph will be well within the limits of the tyres, whereas a car travelling at 20mph on std tyres could be well past the limit of the tyres.

Speed on it’s own is not an issue, however inappropriate speed for the vehicle or the conditions however is a big problem.

Indirectly you are claiming that a car with winter tyres on is no safer than one without, as they will be over confident.

I do not mean to be petty but you are reading into my statement a little too closely. Perhaps you have seen someone from an insurance company stick their head over the parapet so thought you'd take a couple of pot shots?

My post was a discussion point, not fact, not rule making, not an official statement. Quite often you need to consider outside factors.

Thanks

It's quite easy to imagine how using winter tyres might not benefit insurance companies as might initially be expected.

First, as has been mentioned, drivers are more willing to go quicker -- I estimate a 20-30 mph speed advantage is available depending on the choice of tyres, and most drivers will tend to drive at just below the speed they feel uncomfortable.

Second is perhaps slightly less obvious; if someone has greater confidence in their ability to get places they almost certainly will be tempted to drive more than if they didn't have winter tyres fitted.

Here's a simple fact. Of all the road accidents I dealt with during the snow & ice this winter not a single one was caused by a driver with winter tyres fitted. The only time a car with winters was involved was when they stopped to avoid an accident in front of them and the car behind (without winters) couldn't stop and ran into the back of it.

Coincidence? I think not!

Winter tyres are getting more popular but, we've got a long long way to go.

Maybe another factor here is the severity of the accidents??

A car with normal tyres may have a low sped accident + low damage.

A car with winter tyres where the driver thinks he is 100% safe may find out that although winter tyres are good, in most circumstances, they are not full proof = big accidence = big claim.

Ice is a prime example. If you hit sheet ice you can have summer tyre/winter tyres 4WD or what ever but no traction = accident. The only thing that will help on this is studs.

Ice is a prime example. If you hit sheet ice you can have summer tyre/winter tyres 4WD or what ever but no traction = accident. The only thing that will help on this is studs.

I beg to differ; the Canadian and other tests showing cars on an ice rink demonstrate that decent friction winter tyres make a huge difference.

In my limited expereince on a variety of snow, frozen snow, compressed frozen snow, polished compressed frozen snow, and so on, I've found that winter tyres (and all season tyres) are much better than summer tyres, and generate a surprising amount of grip. I've driven on surfaces that I have trouble walking on, and the grip levels have felt almost normal.

The most slippery surface conditions I've come across is where frozen compressed snow begins to melt and there is a thin layer of water - I think I might have preferred studded tyres for that, but still the winter tyres provided reasonable grip.

Granted were there is any grip winter tyre will enhance that but I still content that on smooth sheet ice nothing apart from studs will help, and I can say that from nearly 40 years experience of driving on and off road.

Sorry but that is wrong, every year the end of our road (cul de sac) gets polished into sheet ice and everyone gets stuck because it is also on a slight incline, since having decent winter tyres we get out without any wheelspin at all.

Decent winter tyres do grip where normal tyres have no traction at all.

I still content that on smooth sheet ice nothing apart from studs will help

When ice forms it is rarely completely smooth, even when it melts and refreezes. While you may be correct in theory, in practice you're years out of date. The ice rink examples on YouTube should be enough to inform you that friction winter tyres are a significant improvement over normal tyres. Tire Rack have a video where they discuss how studded and studless winter tyres compare, in the context of testing on an ice rink.

Edited 3 March, 201313 yr by AnotherGareth

Decent winter tyres do grip where normal tyres have no traction at all.

Correct, winter tyre will get a grip were normal tyres get no traction but that doesn't mean there is no traction al all on the surface just means the normal tyre can't use it. What I said was no tyre will grip where there is no traction, there is a difference in these statements

The resistance of some people to believe or understand that winter tyres make a significant difference on snow AND ICE really staggers me. I am unaware of anyone suggesting they make you invincible and you obviously still have to drive with care but it stands to reason that the conscientious driver who has made the effort to shod his car with winter tyres is likely to be the type who will indeed take such care. To suggest that over confidence is likely to result in an even bigger accident is ridiculous and hardly a reason not to put winters on. IMHO of course.

Maybe another factor here is the severity of the accidents??

A car with normal tyres may have a low sped accident + low damage.

A car with winter tyres where the driver thinks he is 100% safe may find out that although winter tyres are good, in most circumstances, they are not full proof = big accidence = big claim.

Out of respect for the families devastated I will not elaborate on the severity of some of the accidents but they were most certainly not low damage.

didn't somebody post a vid of two Yeti's on an ice rink comparing winters and summers on an ice rink? Can't seem to find it.

Its all down to risk v the chances of such bad weather.

We have what, 1 or 2 days a year where there may be enough snow fall for a standard tyre not to cope, and in many cases they can with enough tread and without the foot to floor = more grip mentality. You then have poor infrastructure to grit and clear roads as well as an inability & legal requirement of people to help clear side roads and paths as there is in parts of the world that get sustained snowfall and sheet ice for MONTHS of the year EVERY year.

Until this happens in the UK, uptake of winters wont happen, driving standards in snow wont improve, so there isnt a need or desire for insurers to reward for winters.

And until such time as we get such sustained weather in southern and central England I personally dont see a need to invest in them.