http://www.autoevolution.com/news/2014-audi-s3-golf-r-and-leon-cupra-developing-turbo-problems-84773.html

 

http://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/5070-r-mk7-turbo-failure/

 

All a bit worrying if you're about to void the warranty. I think a call to SEAT UK (again) is in order, though they still haven't returned the last call as promised...

I would like to hear a response from VAG but also here from owners. Not seen or heard anything yet on owners forums in UK.

COMMENT SUGGEST A BATCH PROBLEM or is it an early design fault? Mainly exposed on earlier NEW released S3 from Sept 2013 UK?

Have Audi started a Service Campaign (Not Recall)on the earlier models.

Edited 19 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

http://www.autoevolution.com/news/2014-audi-s3-golf-r-and-leon-cupra-developing-turbo-problems-84773.html

 

http://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/5070-r-mk7-turbo-failure/

 

All a bit worrying if you're about to void the warranty. I think a call to SEAT UK (again) is in order, though they still haven't returned the last call as promised...

Steve,

Might be worth asking Audi

Keith, there is an 18 page thread on failed R turbos on Golf mk7 forums. 17.5 pages are just banter / panicky idiots (Oh I wish I'd not bought this dodgy Golf now), and it turns out only 2 failures I think.

There has been one Cupra 280 failure noted on a forum, that's all.

 

Personally, so long as it's covered under some kind of warranty then I couldn't care less.

Just came off a call to VWUK, relating to this Turbo issue mentioned.

My initial discussion with a Technical Admin guy ,suggests that there is nothing currently in circulation relating to this within their Engineering / service departments.

Edited 19 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

Keith, there is an 18 page thread on failed R turbos on Golf mk7 forums. 17.5 pages are just banter / panicky idiots (Oh I wish I'd not bought this dodgy Golf now), and it turns out only 2 failures I think.

There has been one Cupra 280 failure noted on a forum, that's all.

 

Personally, so long as it's covered under some kind of warranty then I couldn't care less.

Steve,

Agree!

Though it does perhaps alter the odds or consideration of remapping. It's not co clear cut perhaps.

Though it does perhaps alter the odds or consideration of remapping. It's not co clear cut perhaps.

Trouble is Steve, as always if we have the facts, then we can make an Engineering judgement - Risk analysis call.

One of the negatives of Forum rants I guess.

Having said that ,sometimes there is no smoke with out fire. Ask the Skoda Fabia vRS GUYS WHO HAVE BEEN AFFECTED by engine issues

Edited 19 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

Trouble is Steve, as always if we have the facts, then we can make an Engineering judgement - Risk analysis call.

One of the negatives of Forum rants I guess.

Having said that ,sometimes there is no smoke with out fire. Ask the Skoda Fabia vRS GUYS WHO HAVE BEEN AFFECTED by engine issues

Indeed. I'd like to know the RPN for the turbo when they did the DFMEA studies.

Always worth being sure snagging faults are ironed out before modifying new models & invalidating the Manufacturers Warranty on Engine/Gearboxes.

Especially with the VWG, because they are never that quick at coming forward and letting the buying public know 

there are issues arising.

If they were more open, then Owners could be more involved in R&D as the cars are used in the real world,

& not just be Factory Testers & Motoring Journalists.

 

http://seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=406147&page=2

Go to the last page George, already been (and the other thread same topic on SCN). No other 280 users have reported problems, and one guy is on stage 2 already

Indeed. I'd like to know the RPN for the turbo when they did the DFMEA studies.

Lots of Hours spent on R&D TESTBED running through variable running underload etc. should have shown up problems.Unfortunately ,as George mentioned the owners appear to be an extension of the Manufacturer R&D department .the 1.4TSI TWINCHARGER is theclassic current example.

Unfortunately it took some 5years for VAG to get to gripswith this problem an until the final engine comes of the production line it will not be fully resolve .

If there is a problem with the Turbo arrangement then perhaps this time they can get their arses in gear and resolve promptly at their expense. with no Customer hassle.

PS.ALL THE MILEAGE COVERED IN COLD CLIMATE /HOT CLIMATE TESTING IN THE CAR ALSO.

All the bells and whistle of monitoring meters and electronics.

Prior to that O.E.M test of the component Assembly- wtf.

Edited 19 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

Keith, we've both worked in the component supply base, so whilst the amount of test and validation that is undertaken, there are always some little niggly design details that are just "lived with" on a commercial cost risk basis. Mind you, disintegrating turbocharge units wouldn't be anything other than a catastrophic project stopper, the brown stuff hits the fan at OE level for far far less critical failures.

That being the case and so few sold or with Private Owners & Companies a letter can go out to all Registered Keepers from

Group Compliance and Campaigns

Volkswagen Group UK LTD

Yeomans Drive

Milton Keynes

MK14 5AN

 

Saying something like,  

'You might be aware as a car enthusiast via Social Networking, Motoring Media or word of mouth that some Volkswagen Group 

Products have Issues with some Models.

Please contact us so that we can confirm your vehicle is not one of the vehicles which may be affected by the issues with Turbos, 

Manual Gearboxes etc...............

 

Simple.

& a Statement from VW / Seat to the Motoring Press & all will be clear and no need for them to say 'Over Blown online'.

VORSPRUNG DURCH TECHNIK

That being the case and so few sold or with Private Owners & Companies a letter can go out to all Registered Keepers from

Group Compliance and Campaigns

Volkswagen Group UK LTD

Yeomans Drive

Milton Keynes

MK14 5AN

 

Saying something like,  

'You might be aware as a car enthusiast via Social Networking, Motoring Media or word of mouth that some Volkswagen Group 

Products have Issues with some Models.

Please contact us so that we can confirm your vehicle is not one of the vehicles which may be affected by the issues with Turbos, 

Manual Gearboxes etc...............

 

Simple.

& a Statement from VW / Seat to the Motoring Press & all will be clear and no need for them to say 'Over Blown online'.

VORSPRUNG DURCH TECHNIK

I think the current position of a black or white there is a problem (recall) or there is no problem (no recall) is easier to manage from an insurance and warranty pov, especially with the growth of 3rd party policies. If a car maker suggests a whiff of a problem, two things will happen: the majority of owners will clamour for a "free" replacement, even if it's not required (see 1.8tsi and 2.0tsi engine failures thread), which won't be free, and you'll be paying for it; and secondly if your turbo does expire, the only guarantor will be the manufacturer, so unless you've bought an extended manufacturers warranty (who no doubt will have a mileage / age limit on a large number of high stressed parts) you're on your own. Let's not give the manufacturers to find another way of selling you replacement parts that you really don't need.

Keith, there is an 18 page thread on failed R turbos on Golf mk7 forums. 17.5 pages are just banter / panicky idiots (Oh I wish I'd not bought this dodgy Golf now), and it turns out only 2 failures I think.

There has been one Cupra 280 failure noted on a forum, that's all.

 

Personally, so long as it's covered under some kind of warranty then I couldn't care less.

Steve,

Have you concluded to still go ahead with your uplift in power and remapping project next week.

Still waiting for them to explain this, 2009-2012, & replacement engines then replaced,

& the Revised engines from 2012 now failing, even in small numbers.

http://revotechnik.com/support/technical/14tsi-twincharger-engine-issues

 

VWG Management try to treat customers like mushrooms, In the dark and shovelled with sharn

& that was how they get taught to at the VW School of 3 monkeys.

Steve,

Have you concluded to still go ahead with your uplift in power and remapping project next week.

On the basis that the mappers own insurance covers exploding engines if a fault of the overstressing it occurs, and this is judged by recall or no recall. If subject to a known fault (TSB etc) then they will not underwrite, obviously. In the absence of any service campaign, I am covered, ergo I will be driving to Norwich next Sunday!

 

Still waiting for them to explain this, 2009-2012, & replacement engines then replaced,

& the Revised engines from 2012 now failing, even in small numbers.

http://revotechnik.com/support/technical/14tsi-twincharger-engine-issues

 

VWG Management try to treat customers like mushrooms, In the dark and shovelled with sharn

& that was how they get taught to at the VW School of 3 monkeys.

All car manufacturers are the same. Try telling Honda UK that you were screwed over by one of their dealers with a faulty clutch, failed cat, and shot rear brake calipers all at 100k miles. Their response was we will dismantle the clutch, if it's our fault we'll replace, if not you pay or collect the bits off the floor. Gun to head approach did not go down well at all, even moaning to my closer contacts at Swindon didn't help (the Accord was built in Japan). How about a just out of warranty Focus 1.6TDi that eventually was discovered to have a knackered wiring loom connecting the high pressure fuel pump to the ECU? Dear customer, get stuffed. 

 

They're all the same, and to be honest, given how stupid a significant number of customers can be, I'd probably be just as sceptical, though there is a pleasant way to tell someone to jump off a bridge and make them feel satisfied with it.

I'd think very carefully about modding one of these and invalidating the warranty with the car on finance. Technically the finance company own the car, not you. Modding without permission can mean breaking the finance agreement.

I recall reading about a guy who modded his Leon and when it broke SEAT interrogated the ECU and discovered traces of the map. They then refused to do any warranty work, the finance company(seat) then cancelled his PCP agreement and demanded immediate payment of the outstanding balance in full......

Of course some mappers will claim to offer a warranty which will cover you if their software causes damage. I just wouldn't personally want to rely on that in case they turn around and say "it's not the fault of the map" when the engine goes pop (like Revo have been known to do). If you have the spare funds available to bank-roll any damage and are happy with that then by all means crack on, but if you haven't got those funds....

I'd think very carefully about modding one of these and invalidating the warranty with the car on finance. Technically the finance company own the car, not you. Modding without permission can mean breaking the finance agreement.

I recall reading about a guy who modded his Leon and when it broke SEAT interrogated the ECU and discovered traces of the map. They then refused to do any warranty work, the finance company(seat) then cancelled his PCP agreement and demanded immediate payment of the outstanding balance in full......

Of course some mappers will claim to offer a warranty which will cover you if their software causes damage. I just wouldn't personally want to rely on that in case they turn around and say "it's not the fault of the map" when the engine goes pop (like Revo have been known to do). If you have the spare funds available to bank-roll any damage and are happy with that then by all means crack on, but if you haven't got those funds....

I agree. Risky game.

But if people had those funds available and wanted to mod it, theyd of probably bought it anyway id of thought?

Even if it wasnt a maps fault, vag would claim it was, and vice versa with the mapping company. Can imagine it going right tits up.

A lot of a gamble for a little but more poke

VWG Companies and other Manufacturers need not claim anything, the Manufacturers Warranty states clearly Exclusions,

& some can be debated,

But they are clear on Enhancements and Modifications out with the Factory Spec or Approved Upgrades.

 

So you pays your money and take your chances, 

but if you are just the Registered Keeper and not the Owner as Furbytom says, proceed with care, and be prepared to cover costs,

Tuners Verbal Warranties and even Written ones can be taken with a pinch of salt mostly.

A PCP is not the same as a lease agreement, it just happens the bank is VWUK, and not Barclays. The bank would technically "own" the car too, but in both cases they don't, it's a personal loan which has similar T&C. Of course if you default on both then at some point a bailiff will call, one hired from VWUK will pinch the car back, the bank probably your TV as well.

 

It is a risk of course, so as ever caveat emptor. I'd never buy a REVO product relying on their interpretation of a warranty, I'd trust Shark a lot more, but even Ben and his guys won't fully underwrite a guarantee (as far as I can tell anyway). I've been through the insurance policy details with the company doing mine, and am satisfied that it will cover parts damaged as a result of the remap being undertaken. This in practice means the turbo, as that's the most stressed parts with the modification. REVO as far as I can tell will technically only warrant the map, not the effects of the map. So, if your ECU melts because they have flashed it, you'll get compensated, but if you car explodes forget it. Well, reflashing a memory chip isn't going to result in any fireworks in the ECU itself so guess what, the warranty is worthless. 

 

Lastly, and most importantly, I get to decide how much extra performance we get, how much extra torque up to the max possible of course, and tbh I'm not interested in smashing it to the max potential; even if it was strong enough to last 200k miles driven like it was stolen every day, I'm pretty sure that the driving experience would be ruined, as it would be a clumsy ham fisted over-torqued understeery mess. I simply want to push the torque curve to a higher point, but using the same slope or rate of climb as OE. REVO claim +95lb/ft on their R remap, well that's about 45Lb/ft too much for me. Target is around 300lb/ft but flat as far up the rev range as is practical so the power delivery is linear, just like OE. It's about finessing a bit more oomph than applying a sledge hammer. 

You gonna do it then Steve?

I agree. Risky game.

But if people had those funds available and wanted to mod it, theyd of probably bought it anyway id of thought?

Even if it wasnt a maps fault, vag would claim it was, and vice versa with the mapping company. Can imagine it going right tits up.

A lot of a gamble for a little but more poke

Thing is Oli, a stage 1 remap on the vRS 2.0 TSI is a bit more than a little more poke. In a straight line it's bonkers. Less impressive on the twistys as the pretty average grip becomes swamped by all that much more difficult to modulate wave of torque, so an uprated RARB is pretty much essential if you want to avoid that slipping head first into the scenery sensation on every RAB.

You gonna do it then Steve?

Yes, made my mind up a while ago. I was a bit more gung ho with the octy, it's not as stressed, but then the engine is not as strong either, and I remapped that the day after I bought it. I used the STS system to hide it when I had it serviced, but this time I cannot do that, so had to have some form of guarantee if it went wrong. It won't, as there are so much forum angst over the slightest number of failures. Most of my mileage is up and donw the M-ways at a steady 80 70 anyway, so it's not going to be stressed much, plus my warranty will expire pretty quickly. I could buy an extended warranty, but the prospect of spending £500 a year for potentially (and hopefully) no benefit, when the cash would be better spent on a new bigger turbo if it does go bang!