Vrs spark plug tip missing

[Candy White]

My car has lost the end of the spark plug in cylinder 2. The breakdown service read the faults that were stored as multiply miss fires on cylinders 2 and 4,he cleared the faults and restarted the car there was no misfiring or uneven running. He then decided to check the plugs as when running no warning lights came back on it was then discovered the end of the plug was missing. The car is now at a main dealers waiting for diagnostics/inspection were they are saying that it could be faulty coil pack which has caused the plug to fall apart, My question is could a coil cause the plug to fail if so im looking at quite a big bill to repair. Car is 2011 vrs full skoda history and spark plugs changed 18 months/6000 miles ago. Any help/input gratefully received. 

[xman]

The only things that causes a spark plug to disintegrate are faulty manufacture, incorrect heat range fitted or excessive heat due to incorrect combustion conditions which may be mixture related or timing related.

Coil paks cant kill plugs in this way.

Is it the inner tip that is missing or the ground electrode? Is it burnt away?

If it was broken off there is a high chance of major damage to the bores or the exhaust valve/seat and turbo exhaust vanes, not good.

A picture would help to diagnose.

Edited 3 January, 2017 by xman

[Ootohere]

The Fabia vRS 1.4 TSI CAVE / CTHE Spark Plug warning thread is pinned at the top of the page.

 

No good news sadly.

 

PS

Suggest to that person at the Dealership that the issues with the Spark Plug which are known, the failing plug causes premature Coil Failure with these engines and not the other way around.

1 Spark Plugs failure being common due to the Engine / Inlet design, fouled and oiled and a cooked plug.

http://revotechnik.com/support/technical/14tsi-twincharger-engine-issues

 

OEM Plugs are the ones at the bottom row.

Edited 4 January, 2017 by Offski

[Ootohere]

Look at the plug with the burnt out tip. This does not break off, no damage if caught in time. Engine not destroyed, so have them use probe to film the cylinder / bore
Not take head off. Use a borescope
Vorsprung Dutch technik

EDIT

that was a typo but Dutch or probably better than Durch. They never learn and must smoke lots and have memory loss.

Edited 4 January, 2017 by Offski

[Warrior193]

Look at the plug with the burnt out tip. This does not break off, no damage if caught in time. Engine not destroyed, so have them use probe to film the cylinder / bore

Not take head off. Use a borescope

Vorsprung Dutch technik

I agree with Offski, the OP might just be lucky. These plugs look as though the incorrect heat range might have been fitted - or the engine was running very lean. If the first, I would be asking the fitter for an explanation.

[Ootohere]

Google 'lucifer' 1.4tsi fundamental design faults. We know why VW group had to change spark plug type and reduce the gap, and still the plugs were ****e

why those that care go to DENSO plugs.

[Kobayashi]

Your car sound exactly like mine 10 months ago.

 

It is best to uprate the spark plugs to stop the tip breaking off. Mine did this on a coil pack 3 spark plug 3 (10 months ago)

 

When it happened to me, intermittently i had EPC + Engine Control Light on

 

Temporarily, my local fixer garage (not skoda) put an OEM Plug in and new coil pack (cost was about £70) - No damage done.

 

Car was an oil burner & my plugs were coked in oil. Luckily no damage done.

[Ootohere]

Lucifer's Ultimate Guide to the 1.4 TSI Fundamental Design Faults and components from the Seatcupra.net forum

http://seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=407682

[Candy White]

Thanks all for your replies! Have found my invoice from when the plugs were changed and the part number listed is: 101905626. After looking on the net, this plug does not seem to be listed for a Fabia VRS. Is this correct, does anyone know? Still waiting for the dealer (at £90 + vat per hour) to come back to me with their findings but get the distinct impression they are not going to accept any fault.

[Ootohere]

I bumped a spark plug thread.

 

Those spark plugs are the PZF R6R / NGK 5758 That were used in 2010/11 before VW / Skoda changed the plugs they used and reduced the gap.

So someone in a Skoda Dealership should not have fitted those really after 2012/13

 

Many have and they last more than 6,000 miles normally, but then your car could have been re-mapped or even just is running the latest software.

[Candy White]

The car has never been remapped as I have owned the car from new and serviced every year at skoda main dealer. I'm hoping that any updates for the ecu software would have been done at the service's.

[Ootohere]

GOOD,  really good.

 

So ask the Service Manager & the Master Tech to look at the TPI on spark plugs and ask why they fitted the spark plugs they did if only 18 months ago.

The Dealership might have to get their insurance company on the case.

 

Spark Plugs are normally considered as Consumables but these ate long life spark plugs and the Service Schedule / Guidelines from VW are chaged at 40,000 miles 

but they knew and know that 1 was expiring at half that, hence the TPI and Plug Change and reduced gap.

 

Plugs have been changed / replaced under warranty because OEM replacement parts have a 2 year warranty. 

 

So the Dealership Principal best talk to you as well, because the Dealership might need to pay up on their error.

Edited 4 January, 2017 by Offski

[Candy White]

Many thanks offski ,so tomorrow I shall be asking the questions and hopefully getting some answers that are in my favour.

[Warrior193]

Many thanks offski ,so tomorrow I shall be asking the questions and hopefully getting some answers that are in my favour.

Hi CW, how did it go with the dealer today?

[Candy White]

UPDATE: Have been in contact with the dealership today and was first told that the master tech looked at plug 2 and said the car is a heavy oil user and this is what has caused the spark plug tip to melt/burn out. They recommended a new engine!! Have at last been able to confirm that the plug 101905626 was fitted and according to their records was the correct one at that time BUT if I can find or confirm somewhere in writing that this plug was in fact superceeded before they fitted it in 2015 then I possibly have a case against someone. Any help, as always, gratefully received....hoping someone knows where I can get this info. Cheers

Edited 5 January, 2017 by Candy White

[Ootohere]

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/337700-oem-spark-plugs-vrs

See post #15 in this thread.

03C905601B  is SIZFR6B8EG  & the plugs that Skoda / VW changed to because of the issues with the previous plugs used, they also reduced the plug gap.

[Ootohere]

Can you explain please.

 

?

Was your car a heavy oil user, ie were you having to put in lots of Oil?

 

The issues are  known and one plug can foul even when an engine is not a heavy oil user, 

but if the Master Tech is going to support this as being a Low Mileage Twincharger Lemon then Skoda UK know that out of warranty they still need to replace the engine at their expense.

?

Has the Dealership during the time they have done the Servicing ever done a Software Update on your ECU?

?

Did they make any comment on the Spark Plug condition only 6,000 miles ago when they changed the Spark Plugs.

(Not to call them liars, but did you see the plugs that came out 6,000 miles ago?)

[Candy White]

Cheers offski, I have to produce something official in writing by skoda UK to show the date the plug was actually superseded. Looked at post #15 on the linked thread and can't see an official date or anything about the plug being superseded. Sorry but I have to go in with evidence as they are trying massively to gloss over the situation shall we say! Thanks

[Candy White]

Just seen your other post...we must have been typing at the same time lol! To answer your questions I was putting in approx 1 litre every 1,500 miles so would have passed a skoda oil consumption test. I presume any ECU updates have been done automatically by them as it has full dealer history. No comments were ever made about the original spark plugs when they were changed and in fact, I have them as weirdly I asked if I could have the old ones back as proof they'd actually been changed......got a few funny looks but glad I did now.

Edited 5 January, 2017 by Candy White

[Ootohere]

I am looking for the date of the change.

 

For Official the Dealership & Skoda UK have it on their system,

There was a TPI / Technical Product Information.  So that is where and when Skoda / VW inform the Technicians. 

 

A helpful and very good Technician might be along that can help.  

 

JAMES where are you?

[Ootohere]

I will try and find something Official but not at home presently.

 

Post #70.

 December 2014

and the Spark Plugs being fitted had changed after VW decided the others were sh!te.  So were the new ones, but hey ho.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/337394-disaster-strikes/page-3

[James@RRG_Skoda_Rochdale]

I don't have access to TPIs at home as my user details only work on our extranet at work - I will by all means have a look into the presence of the TPI against your vehicle if you want to pm me your chassis number?

I have come across a handful of fabia VRS' where the beginning signs of their oil burning issues starts with the destruction of the tip of plug number 2. The presence of oil in the cylinder fouls the plug and hinders the combustion process, the ECU increases the spark strength/duration to compensate which erodes the tip down to nothing.

I've seen plugs last no longer than a few months after fitting due to the extent of the oil burning issue.

What kind of relationship do you have with your dealer?

[Candy White]

Have sent you a message James thanks

[Dr3w_vrs]

Hi there

 

Just been reading over your thread. Has some similarities to my own experience recently. My engine was took out by a broken valve.

 

I see you're in the West Midlands. I had a recent engine replacement done with Stourbridge Skoda. I definitely would NOT recommend them though, so I hope you do not have the misfortune of dealing with them.

The work carried out was perfectly adequate, but their customer service is terrible.

 

I would be happy to share more details of my case if you require it. I did receive a Goodwill contribution towards the engine replacement.

[Candy White]

Hi, Dr3w_vrs

 

Thanks for your kind offer I will possibly pm you when I have more answers. The problem at the minute is that neither my dealer or Skoda UK can give me a definite answer? Simple question of how many spark plug part numbers are listed or have been listed for a vrs. When I get an answer then that will determine the next route that I take regarding getting my car back. Many thanks