7sp DQ200 DSG failure

[Sittingbull]

Some of the longer term members here will recall that our wee car, 2012 CAVE engined vRS had an engine replaced under warranty by Skoda UK at 26k miles due to excessive oil consumption. Since then I'm pleased to report that the engine hasn't used a drop of oil between services. All good on that front.

 

But not so on the DSG, the other issue known to have affected these great little cars, as well as those fitted with the 7sp DQ200 DSG across the VAG range.

 

Ours (the gearbox) had been performing brilliantly until Tuesday 16th January this year when, in a blizzard that saw us end up with more than a foot of snow in this area, a flashing spanner appeared in the top right hand corner of the MFD where it would normally indicate which gear the car was in at the time. This spanner, at that stage, had no bearing on how the car was driving, it was still perfect. Definitely a spanner, rather than a gear cog or similar. The spanner wouldn't appear until a few miles into a journey, once the car had warmed up.

 

My wife owns the car and drives the car almost every day and she didn't think it was the normal advisory notice that you might get that your car was approaching time for a service, so a wee bit concerned I phoned 2 Skoda main dealers (Parks and Ingram) to find out if this was something we should be concerned about. After the folk on the service reception at both places spoke to technicians, both places advised that this spanner was an indicator that the car was due an inspection service and that the symbol could only be reset by the main dealer. In terms of mileage, our car has done 66880 with a full service history. The next service per the mfd was due in 168 days or 4400 miles.

 

So I booked the car into Ingrams Skoda at Ayr for yesterday morning, 3rd February. The car was used sparingly, perhaps covering 100 miles from the date of spanner appearing until yesterday, again with no driving issues whatsoever.

 

Yesterday morning, we set off for Ayr, a trip of 40 odd miles for us and one we thought would see a successful resolution. Unfortunately we managed to get no further than 10ft initially, as the flashing spanner not only appeared but the car slipped from showing D1 or D2 to simply showing D on the display with a loss of forward movement.

 

I switched the ignition off, removed the key and then restarted. This time the car allowed us to travel 6 miles. Then it simply lost all forward momentum when attempting to go up an incline, with the previous D6 on the display being replaced by D once again. Engine off, restarted, turned back for home for fear of being stranded should it break down completely. Same thing happened twice more on way back home. Occasionally, and manual drivers among you will know what I mean, you could hear the engine roar without the car going anywhere any quicker, like the clutch was depressed while your foot was trying to accelerate.

 

We parked the car up, fearful of attempting to move it and began a series of phone calls and emails trying to organise the next steps. We then left the car for 12 hours or so until last night and attempted to move it all of 15ft to a better parking spot. This time the spanner appeared immediately and the car resolutely decides it ain't moving at all. So a non runner.

 

Parks Skoda can't see it until 21 February.

 

With thanks to George on here, and who has asked me to write this up, can I ask if other members have had similar type issues with the DSG whereby it has been a flashing spanner rather than a gear cog? And has then lost all mobility? Was it down to the MCU? Clutch packs? Corrosion of wires from a leaking component on the MCU? 

 

All of the aforementioned or None?

 

We're devastated. We realise we're staring down the barrel of a big bill. Any experiences of similar situation welcomed.

 

Richard.

[SeaGoat]

You have my sympathy (and have aroused my concern).
Hopefully it will just be some failed sensor rather than anything more serious.
Best wishes for a not too expensive resolution!

[Sittingbull]

8 hours ago, SeaGoat said:

You have my sympathy (and have aroused my concern).
Hopefully it will just be some failed sensor rather than anything more serious.
Best wishes for a not too expensive resolution!

 

Thanks buddy, I would bite your arm off right now to learn it was only a sensor. 

 

As it stands we're likely to have to tow/ trailer the car into Parks Skoda on 21st February and cough up the cost of doing so along with the diagnostic charge of £102 inc VAT. Once they have done this check plus a visual inspection we will know more and can work out next steps. I'm hopeful but not confident that Skoda UK will respond positively to my email sent yesterday.

 

Its a strange one, apparently transmission issues normally show as a gear cog in the MFD whereas ours is definitely a spanner. Both main dealers reckoned it was inspection service light. 

 

The only other thing that has happened is that the switch to operate the electric door mirrors has failed at the same time. Still heat up but need to be moved manually.

 

Motors are a massive pain when something like this goes wrong.

[Kobayashi]

Can you get any fault codes from the ECU OBD2 - Carista APP etc... 

[Sittingbull]

16 hours ago, Kobayashi said:

Can you get any fault codes from the ECU OBD2 - Carista APP etc... 

 

I'll get my son to try this later, truth be told though I wouldn't know where to start once I have them as I would need vagcom?

 

Car is non runner. Looks like a carbon copy of the case on another thread albeit from a few years back where after an engine change the spanner symbol replaces the gear cog for some reason. I'm in the process of making arrangements to have car trailered into a dealer, but still undecided which one.

 

Parks Skoda are ready to take car in although cannot guarantee being able to look at the wee car before 21 February, if I can trailer in they will try to get onto ramps sooner and carry out diagnostic plus visual inspection. I've still not heard anything back from my email to Skoda UK and as I said previously I'm not confident I will gain any help at this point from them, perhaps some backing from the dealer will help.

 

The other option is to trailer car into another nearby dealer, VW dealer, they've said they will pop it up onto ramps and see what is wrong and give me a price for the car to buy from me. I'm at the stage of weighing up keeping or not. I won't be rushed into getting rid as it could be a relatively small repair although it doesn't seem like it at the moment.

[Kobayashi]

1 hour ago, Sittingbull said:

 

I'll get my son to try this later, truth be told though I wouldn't know where to start once I have them as I would need vagcom?

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G99G778K6Ss

 

If he knows how to use OBD2 and has the scanner to plug in & connect to phone, then its basically scanning for faults via bluetooth. Some minor ones can be reset (such as oil) but if its something more then 'clearing fault' usually brings it back up again in the next 30 mins or straight away. Garage's uses VAGCOM to do this as you know. 

 

If you can scan then this at least gives the owner some indication and is better than going in blind.....

 

Might not give everything that VAGCOM does, but a major spanner or gearcog should show something via the OBD2.... 

 

 

[JGrindel]

Wish you the best of luck... not the ideal thing to happen to early on into 2018!! Lets hope its not serious 

[Sittingbull]

Quick update, still no reply from Skoda UK Customer Services so I've used the email I had from them at the time of engine change in 2014 to contact them hoping for a response.

 

Not been able to get a hold of my son to plug in his obd2 reader thing and won't matter now, I've had car recovered to Parks Skoda in Hamilton for them to carry out diagnostic and visual inspection and then give us the news.

 

I'll keep this updated.

 

One quick question.

 

On ebay there are 3 DSG gearboxes available for 1.4tsi Polo gti, mk2 vRS. Would it be a straight fit or do numbers need to match?

[Ootohere]

Simple question for those that have had a DQ200 DSG in any vehicle and Failure, Mechatronic Control Unit or Clutch Packs.

 

?

Did you get a Spanner showing or flashing in the Maxidot before you had the symptoms?

[Sittingbull]

I now know of at least 3 cases where the flashing spanner has appeared in the top right corner of the MFD, one, aside from ours, is ongoing with Skoda but that car is under warranty and the owner has kind of distanced themselves from the process as its not coming out of their pocket. The lad did confirm to me though that his car had an engine change in September 17.

 

 

[Sittingbull]

And so to the bad news......

 

The car has now undergone the visual and diagnostic check at the Skoda dealer. As was the case with at least one other car on here in the past, the flashing spanner in the top right of the multi function display has replaced the flashing gear cog, something that seems to happen after an engine change. 

 

Also, as with the other cases, the flashing spanner in the top right does indeed indicate a problem with the transmission. In our case, an excessive oil leak within the mechatronic unit due to component failure, that of a pressure pump failing. Our car therefore requires a new mechatronic unit, which is being fitted by the dealer sometime this coming week.

 

As for Skoda UK Customer Services, I'm not sure I could do justice to my feelings on here without risking a lifetime ban. Their starting point of "if it's shown to be a mechanical defect or a known issue we'll be happy to do all we can to assist" really translates as "we've built a shedload of cars that we know to be of insufficient quality to last the test of time due to the poor quality of components we used, but hey dummy you were daft enough to buy one so the buck stops with you"

 

For reference for other folk unfortunate to have this happen, the cost of supply and fit the mechatronic unit including the diagnostic check is £1750. 

[Ootohere]

Hope all is well now, are you back with the car and any assistance from Skoda UK over the DSG repairs?

[mrgf]

That is a chunk of dough! Be sure to let them know though, that THEY WILL BE LIABLE FOR FAILURE IN THE NEXT TWO YEARS as new parts have a two year warranty. If they fix it under warranty or goodwill, the warranty ends with the original one.

[Sittingbull]

19 hours ago, Offski said:

Hope all is well now, are you back with the car and any assistance from Skoda UK over the DSG repairs?

 

My apologies, I should have updated this thread.

 

I won't go into the whole story again as I have posted elsewhere about how the situation developed with Parks Skoda  (which should carry a google translation of "avoid like the plague") and how they misdiagnosed the issue not once, not twice, but thrice causing a great deal of stress and anxiety. The car was away for 8.5 weeks but is now back in my possession, freshly MOT'd and Serviced.

 

The short story is this.

 

2012 CAVE engined VRS with an engine replaced in September 2014 developed an issue in January 2018, notifying me as driver via a flashing diagonal white spanner in the PRNDS area of the Multi function Display ie dash. The flashing diagonal white spanner is not accompanied by an audible warning, nor is there a visual warning/ reminder in the centre of the MFD.

 

The flashing diagonal white spanner in the PRNDS area turned out to be the car's way of telling us it needed a new Mechatronic Control Unit, and in our case clutch packs as well. Our gearbox section with levers and so on is absolutely fine.  Edited: Our car never had the service action on the DSG, no sticker on tyre well and confirmed via telephone at the time that not required.

 

Skoda UK are aware of several cases including ours where this flashing white diagonal spanner has appeared in the PRNDS area, Their official line seems to be and seems likely to remain that they do not recognise this as a known issue or mechanical defect therefore any goodwill will be very hard fought for, if it can be found at all. In our case we received goodwill of £200 from Skoda UK and £200 from Parks Skoda, meaning the final bill came down from £3200 to £2800. This goodwill was not in recognition of admission of parts failure or fault with the DSG. The goodwill was officially offered to recognise a misdiagnosis citing the car needed a gearbox, along with clutch packs and MCU.

 

In addition, Skoda UK gave us £60 to acknowledge the stress and inconvenience caused by the long delays. I know this isn't nearly enough. But, before rushing to judge, I wanted the motor back and a resolution due to the effects this was all having on my wife's health. 

 

I will break down the costs for reference in case other owners are unfortunate enough to encounter similar problem.

 

Gearbox, sourced from TPS, will cost you as the customer £3988 plus the cost of fitting. With Parks, that total cost would have been over £5200.

 

Mechatronic Unit, supplied and fitted by Parks, was quoted at £1750. The part itself cost £1100.

 

Clutch packs supplied and fitted were £1100, with the parts themselves costing £585.

 

The balance of the original quote for us of £3200 included an additional fee for sending our gearbox to a transmission specialist. This fee was effectively written off by the goodwill from Skoda UK and Parks. It should never have been included in the first place.

Edited 22 April, 2018 by Sittingbull
Forgot to say no service action ever undertaken on DSG

[Sittingbull]

14 hours ago, mrgf said:

That is a chunk of dough! Be sure to let them know though, that THEY WILL BE LIABLE FOR FAILURE IN THE NEXT TWO YEARS as new parts have a two year warranty. If they fix it under warranty or goodwill, the warranty ends with the original one.

 

See post above, we ended up paying £2800 to get car back from dealer, car needed mechatronic unit and clutch packs. Parts have 2 years warranty from Skoda UK, plus we have a workmanship guarantee of one year given by Parks. This has been confirmed by Skoda UK.

 

All in though, we have spent almost £3500.

 

Parks were asked to put the car through its MOT as it expired while in their garage. Skoda UK asked them to do this and provided a voucher to cover the cost. Having offered £400 in goodwill between them to get the bill for DSG repair down, Parks then failed the car on it's MOT and quoted a figure just shy of £400 to repair and pass the car. We uplifted the car and took it elsewhere, where it passed with no advisories. 

[rum4mo]

We should applaud the way that Park's attempted to win back that £400 that you got lifted from the total cost, I'm guessing that some dealership chains send their people on courses to be able to do that, a very modern British business approach to things, how refreshing - not!

[mrgf]

No coincidence then, that they are called Parks, judging by how long your car remained "Parked" in their possession!

 

I absolutely abhor these types of dealerships that try to plunder your wallet for a larger wedge then they are entitled to.  Regarding the MOT situation, I would contact Skoda UK and appraise them of this, too as it is blatant rip-off and as ambassadors to the main dealer, Parks should have a massive blasting from head office, even perhaps, having their franchise revoked.

 

Can you back up the claim that you had the car uplifted and it passed without fault? The Parks recorded mileage and the new MOT station's mileage stated on the documents, if identical ar at least, very close, will corroborate the fact, along with a testimonial from the latter tester, that the vehicle had no remedial works undertaken, prior to the re-test. 

 

Parks should be told to hit the highway!

[DennisMenaced]

Jesus Christ Sittingbull that's hard to swallow. I have been looking for a Fabia MK2 for a couple of months now. I have always had manual gearboxes but a few weeks ago came across an auto Fabia with the DSG box. Went home and investigated these DSG offerings and read horror stories.

Hope all is now well with your car chum.

[SeaGoat]

11 hours ago, mrgf said:

[SNIP]

Regarding the MOT situation, I would contact Skoda UK and appraise them of this

[SNIP]

 

 

The Hell with that, I would inform the DofT.

One or other party is behaving fraudulently.

MOT testing is vitally important for ensuring safety, not an opportunity to rip-off drivers.

[mrgf]

Amen to that! I know no-one likes the idea of their vehicle failing the MOT but you wouldn't want to drive a defective car, either... 

I think rip-off merchants rely on that to ensure you worry too much and foot the bill for either un-needed work to be done or not even undertaken work!

[Sittingbull]

As I'm off out to work I'll keep this brief.

 

Are SUK aware of the failing of the MOT at Parks? Yes.

Were they disappointed? Yes

Have I made them aware of my feelings? Yes

Did that include observations about the public face of SUK at forecourt level letting them down badly? Yes

Is case still open at SUK? Yes

Did car pass with no remedial work undertaken? Yes

Are SUK aware of this? Yes

Are VOSA/ DfT aware of differences? Not as yet.

Would I recommend Parks Skoda? No.

 

And for the poster worried about buying a car with the DSG, don't be. It's a very good system and will stand up to an awful lot. What has happened with our mk2 Fabia vRS and the 7sp DQ200 gearbox fitted to them is not reflective of the DSG system overall, do not let our experience put you off. Just, as ever, do the homework prior to buying.