We recently bought a new Karoq 1.5tsi petrol with manual gearbox. After leaving the showroom we encountered a flat spot when changing down to second gear at around 8 miles an hour. There was no take up at all. I initially put this down to new car inexperience.

Shortly after, it happened again at a roundabout when I wanted to take advantage of of a gap in traffic and again no power when changing to second gear at around 7 or 8 miles an hour.

 

Within a week I took the car back to the dealership who put it on the fault finder and told me there was nothing wrong with the car. Apparently my wife and I have to adjust our driving style to suit the vehicle.

We explained that we felt vulnerable with the vehicle not having power when required and explained that during a trip to Lincoln we found ourselves drifting into traffic on a busy roundabout, because the vehicle wouldn’t pull away.

The staff at the dealership were sympathetic and it was suggested that we change down to first gear while the vehicle is still in motion, below 8 miles an hour.

 

Has anyone else on this forum had this problem and if not may I suggest you try changing down to second gear at below 8 miles an hour to test your vehicle’s reactions.

We also have the kangaroo in first gear, especially when the vehicle is cold.

Did you previously drive a diesel? As at those speeds for second gear is fine but I would have though it would have been much too low on the rev range for a petrol engine.

Better add your post to this thread. Your problem is discussed at length there.

 

2 hours ago, Rustyman said:

We recently bought a new Karoq 1.5tsi petrol with manual gearbox. After leaving the showroom we encountered a flat spot when changing down to second gear at around 8 miles an hour. There was no take up at all. I initially put this down to new car inexperience.

Shortly after, it happened again at a roundabout when I wanted to take advantage of of a gap in traffic and again no power when changing to second gear at around 7 or 8 miles an hour.

 

Within a week I took the car back to the dealership who put it on the fault finder and told me there was nothing wrong with the car. Apparently my wife and I have to adjust our driving style to suit the vehicle.

We explained that we felt vulnerable with the vehicle not having power when required and explained that during a trip to Lincoln we found ourselves drifting into traffic on a busy roundabout, because the vehicle wouldn’t pull away.

The staff at the dealership were sympathetic and it was suggested that we change down to first gear while the vehicle is still in motion, below 8 miles an hour.

 

Has anyone else on this forum had this problem and if not may I suggest you try changing down to second gear at below 8 miles an hour to test your vehicle’s reactions.

We also have the kangaroo in first gear, especially when the vehicle is cold.

 

That may be your answer.

 

Always be in a responsive gear - goes the slogan from a certain Advanced Motorist organisation.

 

Pussy footing around in a high gear, sometimes chasing elusive optimistic fuel consumption figures, makes for a very lethargic drive. (and ECO mode kills it completely)

 

Go play with the Rev limiter sometime to see what the car can really do when you want/need it to Get A Move On.

 

Try 3rd in a 30. 4th in a 40. It’s much more fun.

 

ps - my good lady’s 1.4 DSG motor can really fly when needed with DSG in Sport mode or even manual to hold gears when needed

Edited 9 November, 20187 yr by BoxerBoy

My 1.2tsi Roomster can be slow away if still in second on roundabouts and junctions and the engine is below the 1500 rpm and turbo takeup. I often change into first gear to avoid that flatspot. Although not good practice but you can slip the clutch so it engages above 1500rpm and then you have turbo thrust with no flatspot in emergencies

Edited 9 November, 20187 yr by edbostan

I think Rustyman is talking no take up at all i.e. dead flat, which should not happen especially on a 1.5tsi.

 

This is not a driver issue but no doubt the low speed issue being reported across the VAG range, Octavia, Karoq, T-Roc etc affecting all 1.5tsi and "a fix is being worked on"

 

We have an 86ps fabia and 105ps Octavia both 1.2tsi and the fabia particularly goes like sh?t off a shovel even from as little as 1200 rpm in 2nd and never feels flat or fails to accelerate promptly.

Xman is correct, vehicle sometimes stalls with no response. Didn't quite understand boxerboys response regarding pussyfooting around in higher gears to save fuel. I don't recall doing that. I may have to alter the way I manage this. But I don't know what we can do about the kangaroo, have seen the other thread and will put my two Pennyworth on there.

It is the same on the 1.0L engine but I'd have thought on the 1.5 it wouldn't have been an issue. Clearly it is. 

1.0 TSI different issue.  The 1.0 TSI one, a 3 cylinder limited power engine in a heavy vehicle.

 

The 1.4 TSI is not worth the mention, it evolved, worked then got discontinued.  Except SEAT just had it WLTP Approved in the Alhambra to see them to end of production.  Crap with a Manual Box in the Alhambra though. 

 

So the 1.5 TSI Manual is the issue. Seemingly now VW Group accept that. 

& according to a post about a communications with a Resolution Manager @ Skoda UK, Cherie Cornish they are aware of an issue with some 1.5 TSI DSG's.

Maybe that is some mix up though.  But time will tell.

Received my 1.5 manual a week ago. Traveled  450km. No kangarooing, I can start in first gear without any isues on as low as 1000rpm. 

My previous car was Ceed 1.4 petrol non-turbo. 

But what is obvious is that there is a slight drop in rpms when I'm trying to start moving, right at the point when I press accelerator and release clutch enough for car to start rolling, if I do not keep pressing accelerator futher  car will drop rpms and turn off.

And there is flat spot in 2nd gear, most noticable when you slow down and try to join roundabout, junction  or overtake in slow traffic. 

My previous experience is that 1st gear is only to start rolling, shift to 2ng gear as soon as possible. But now it looks like that I should drive in 1st. I never did once in my life had vehicle that required to shift in 1st while moving to get enough power in low revs. I have a felling that 1.5 manual is not designed around pussyfooting in low gears and really likes more revs specially in 1st and 2nd gear.

 

As has been mentioned, those of us used to driving diesel engine cars will likely have to adapt to the absence of low-down torque when moving to a petrol engine.

 

The lack of torque needs to be mitigated with increased RPM.

On 09/11/2018 at 20:49, Rustyman said:

We recently bought a new Karoq 1.5tsi petrol with manual gearbox. After leaving the showroom we encountered a flat spot when changing down to second gear at around 8 miles an hour. There was no take up at all. I initially put this down to new car inexperience.

Shortly after, it happened again at a roundabout when I wanted to take advantage of of a gap in traffic and again no power when changing to second gear at around 7 or 8 miles an hour.

 

Are you changing up into second (1 > 2) or down into second (3 >2)?

 

To change "down" to 2nd at 8mph is likely to be your problem. You need to be changing down to 2nd from 3rd well before your speeds drop this low.

 

For urgent acceleration at 8mph you need to be in 1st.

 

As mentioned above, this is less likely to be necessary with a diesel, but the 1.4 TST ACT / 1.5 TSI ACT will quickly bog down if the RPM isn't high enough, as you're experiencing.

 

I have the 1.4 TSI manual (all but identical driving characteristics to the 1.5) in a much heavier Kodiaq and the same applies. She likes RPM. I've been caught out on a few slow speed steep inclines. A diesel would simply surge up on tickover, riding the torque curve. In the Kodiaq I found myself having to make a rapid down change from 2nd to 1st to avoid stalling the engine.

26 minutes ago, silver1011 said:

As has been mentioned, those of us used to driving diesel engine cars will likely have to adapt to the absence of low-down torque when moving to a petrol engine.

 

The lack of torque needs to be mitigated with increased RPM.

More accurately, adapt to certain petrol engines, like the smaller VWG ones.

 

As well as my diesel Yeti we have two petrol cars, my 2.0 TSI TT and my wife's Mini Cooper S which I have no trouble driving after the Yeti and don't have to adapt my pulling away. The Mini in particular (a 1.6 turbo, so not much bigger) has a lovely flexible engine that will pull in second from virtually a stand still without a murmur.

 

As has been said, the problem is less to do with a lack of low down torque but rather a bad flat spot just where you don't need it! 

Edited 14 November, 20187 yr by VAGCF

28 minutes ago, silver1011 said:

As has been mentioned, those of us used to driving diesel engine cars will likely have to adapt to the absence of low-down torque when moving to a petrol engine.

 

The lack of torque needs to be mitigated with increased RPM.

Nonsense, my 1.4tsi act Superb and indeed all our petrol cars 2 x 1.2 tsi and even our humble htp can pull cleanly away in 2nd at below 1000 rpm without any drama.

 

Old school 1.9tdi diesels up to Euro 3 and some 4 pulled like a train even well below idle, I could pull away from a start in 3rd in my old Alhambra no problem. Then Euro 5 onwards, things started to go sour when emissions regs made them into a weedy shadow of what they used to be. Many EU5 diesels I've driven stalled on me at roundabouts.

 

So, no Rustyman is not at fault because as most drivers, they adapt to a new car within minutes  of driving it.

8mph barely registers on the speedo so if the OP is in 2nd gear then it is likely the engine speed is well below 1,000 RPM.

 

Being off the clutch doing 8mph suggests the car is running on tick-over. If I do the same in my 1.4 TSI Kodiaq and then depress the throttle with any degree of urgency there is the same brief lag, or as is being described here, a flat spot.

 

Whilst modern petrol's are equipped with anti-stall features, to suggest the driving characteristics of petrol and diesel engines are the same is simply not true.

 

Edited 14 November, 20187 yr by silver1011

1 hour ago, VAGCF said:

As has been said, the problem is less to do with a lack of low down torque but rather a bad flat spot just where you don't need it! 

 

Having experienced it I can say it is definitely torque related. Even when you pass the lull the 1.4 / 1.5 lacks low down grunt.

 

Engine torque (Nm) for the 150PS 1.4 TSI is 250. The two current diesels are 340 (150PS 2.0 TDI) and 400 (190PS 2.0 TDI). 

 

Recommending diesel for towing and off-roading is done for a reason, they're stronger at slow speeds / low RPM.

 

I've had numerous diesels, so am well aware of their characteristics.

 

If it's due to a lack of torque then explain this to me. Why are some cars affected and some not? And why is it that some who bought early cars were perfectly fine until they had a software "update" applied? That doesn't sound like a lack of low down grunt to me, more like a software glitch.

 

What form is the fix going to take. Some miraculous increase in torque! 

 

And why is an even smaller engine, the 1.4 just dandy? I accept that in the Kodiaq it is probably borderline for that size and weight of vehicle but in other cars it seems to be a good choice. The 1.5 is having issues across a number of VWG models which are smaller than the Kodiaq so there shouldn't really be any pulling away problems due to a lack of torque.

Edited 14 November, 20187 yr by VAGCF

When was the connection made between the OP's 2nd gear issue, and the wider issue of pulling away in 1st gear? For all we know these are two separate 'characteristics'.

 

The exact same engine in two different cars can be leagues apart. The mapping can be completely different, so just because a 1.5 TSI is fine in the Octavia, doesn't mean it drives the same when fitted and mapped to the Karoq.

 

How and when the torque is delivered is dictated by the software, amongst many other influences, hence the issues some are seeing with the 1st gear pulling away complaints.

 

The 1.4 and 1.5. are identical in terms of Nm / lbs/ft and generate identical levels of torque through the same RPM range. The 1.4 is a good choice in the Kodiaq too, but you have to drive according to the engines characteristics, which due to a lack of torque means driving it differently to a diesel.

 

A smaller petrol engine will always be more susceptible to bogging down under low RPM / high load compared to an equivalent diesel.

 

Edited 14 November, 20187 yr by silver1011

Tonight I thought about this thread so as I drove into town in my humble 3 pot 1.2 htp Fabia, I deliberately went round a roundabout in 5th gear at 19-20mph, which was just a touch below 1000rpm, and floored it at the exit. No hesitation, flat spot or anything. Just picked up as expected confidently without complaint and was soon at  the 40mph limit. My 1.4 tsi Superb is a lot quicker of course.

49 minutes ago, silver1011 said:

When was the connection made between the OP's 2nd gear issue, and the wider issue of pulling away in 1st gear? For all we know these are two separate 'characteristics'.

 

The exact same engine in two different cars can be leagues apart. The mapping can be completely different, so just because a 1.5 TSI is fine in the Octavia, doesn't mean it drives the same when fitted and mapped to the Karoq.

 

How and when the torque is delivered is dictated by the software, amongst many other influences, hence the issues some are seeing with the 1st gear pulling away complaints.

 

The 1.4 and 1.5. are identical in terms of Nm / lbs/ft and generate identical levels of torque through the same RPM range. The 1.4 is a good choice in the Kodiaq too, but you have to drive according to the engines characteristics, which due to a lack of torque means driving it differently to a diesel.

 

A smaller petrol engine will always be more susceptible to bogging down under low RPM / high load compared to an equivalent diesel.

 

Post No. 3 made the connection, rightly or wrongly.

 

When I was talking about some cars being affected and some not I was just talking about the Karoq there - perhaps I should have been clearer. So my question remains, why are some cars affected and some not? If due to a lack of torque it would apply to all.

It will be interesting to see if this second gear problem persists if and when, as they surely must, come up with a fix for the pulling away in first gear issue.

I have been driving my new 1.5 TSi manual Superb Estate for a week now and have experienced exactly the same issue as the OP - a completely blank spot at low revs in second gear. I was inclined to put it down to the fact that I like to change to second quite early when pulling away, but it seems that there may be a problem which is widespread on the 1.5 TSi with manual gearbox.  

 

Alongside this I have been embarrassed daily by the fact that the car kangaroos horribly from a cold start when I drive away in the morning.  (What can the neighbours be thinking? New car and look at that!)

 

I'll be speaking to the dealer tomorrow.

I think you'd get a better response in the main thread, here...

 

 

I thought this was me, i have lived in the same area and pass down the same drive for 25 YEARS, having sold cars for 25 years i must have driven 1000's of cars down my drive. i had the pleasure of driving a Karoq 1.5 SEL manual last night (buy the DSG) and in second gear foot flat on the floor nothing, nothing at all, this is 100% a software issue, just a matter of time i would imagine until it's rectified. As someone said alter your driving style but i've never had to on any other car.

Had this problem a few times now, luckily no bad outcome. Happens when say approaching a roundabout and trying to time the break in the traffic. Change down on approach to second, brake slightly but keep rolling well, at least 10mph, foot on accelerator NOTHING, press harder STILL NOTHING then very very slowly will pick up speed and then engines revving like hell.

 

First gear is for starting off once rolling, second gear should keep momentum no matter what type of engine diesel or petrol. At least that's how it's always been up until Skoda rewrote the rules.