Sorry (messed up first new topic)

 

Searching on the forum certainly turns up some interesting confusion as to servicing!

 

Car (2016 TDI DSG) bought SH from Trader connected to dealer branch @48K miles  

Its currently on Variable with 11300k to go and 473 days and 56K miles now. 

 

Anyway I've been doing some detective work today and spoken to the two dealers the car has been with over its life so far.

 

First dealer had it for 3 services over three years all ~10k miles apart. (happy its had lots of oil changes early on)  They confirmed its had oil and filter on the three plus a pollen filter at 2nd service at 19k. 

Then car moved by the look of it from fixed to variable between third and fourth service with the second dealer. it did 18k from last service at first dealer up to MOT time at the second dealer

Second dealer did oil and filter, DSG oil change and front pads for and MOT. 

 

So its missed, 

Air filter

Fuel filter

Brake fluid at year 3. 

 

Calling a local Main dealer they offered Major Service for £289 (includes fuel filter and air filter) plus £36 for brake fluid if i do that with the major. 

 

Does cost look ok??

Edited 7 February, 20206 yr by paulski
hit enter key..

22 minutes ago, paulski said:

Calling a local Main dealer they offered Major Service for £289 (includes fuel filter and air filter) plus £36 for brake fluid if i do that with the major. 

 

Does cost look ok??

They change oil too on that? If yes i would say it sound reasonable

I was charged for my Roomster £330 for major service and brake fluid change 18 months ago

59 minutes ago, Superhero572 said:

They change oil too on that? If yes i would say it sound reasonable

 

yes oil is changed on a major as well. 

 

Looking forward to the "and we recommend these" coming my way soon...😀

 

But I am keen to keep in dealership servicing given I have  a DSG and coolant tank "Mit Silkat" 

 

 

I think it's well established that dealers make stuff up and do whatever they feel like in terms of servicing.

I swear I've seen a comprehensive list of all the tasks needed at specific age and mileage on here but I can't for the life of me find it right now. 

 

Personally as it's due a service again in ~10k anyway, if there's no issues I'd be tempted to just change the oil and filter now and then do all the required actions at the next service, otherwise you have to have the argument that you don't want them then, as they've already been done...

 

5 hours ago, Alex-W said:

I think it's well established that dealers make stuff up and do whatever they feel like in terms of servicing.

I swear I've seen a comprehensive list of all the tasks needed at specific age and mileage on here but I can't for the life of me find it right now. 

 

Personally as it's due a service again in ~10k anyway, if there's no issues I'd be tempted to just change the oil and filter now and then do all the required actions at the next service, otherwise you have to have the argument that you don't want them then, as they've already been done...

 

thanks Alex-W Indeed i bet if a called another dealer I'd get a different answer. 

 

Yes i have seen some very old posts with "service details" probably earlier models still had some lists somewhere. 

 

But its not had a fuel or air filter ever, from what I gained of the two dealers I spoke to, so if i waited to do another 10k, it would have done 68k, that far too long for those service parts. 

 

I'm still debating as to whether to move from variable to fixed at this major service.  I do ~12k per year of rural road driving often 50 -80 miles + per day for work, and every 10k do the oil change and every 20k do oil and all the filters and brake fluid every 2 years 

 

Comments appreciated. 

 

Can you open the Airfilter box yourself and put in a new Air Filter?

Or when out of Manufacturers or Extended Warranty so after the next time maybe have an Independent VW Specialist do that along with other servicing. They can test the brake fluid for H2O content as well.

 

The Dealership's staff you spoke to at least quoted below the Fixed Price at Participating Dealers Brake Fluid Change at a Service which is £60.

Edited 8 February, 20206 yr by Roottootemblowinootsoot

yes indeed I could easily change out the air filter myself. Was going to when it got it last year, just never got round to it.  

 

The major  £289) includes the Air filter, Fuel filter and they do the brake fluid for £36 (my local indy wouldn't beat that price), I can do the pollen filter easy enough.  But as I said I'm looking to keep dealer service up for a while as its out of warranty and with coolant Mit Silkat issues around (possibly, but mines not got the tea bag I think its the cartridge in the tank) I'm sticking with the "electronic stamps" for a while just in case. 

 

Thanks very much for your input. 

 

 

Edited 8 February, 20206 yr by paulski
added screenshot

To be honest out of warranty i wouldn't use a main dealer for servicing, most indy VW specialists can update the digital service log anyways. If concerned about the "mit silikat" on the tank best thing to do is swap the tank anyway and cut the risk of failure much safer when out of warranty, its hard enough getting Skoda to honour the warranty while you still have one its even harder when outwith

@paulski

Your screen grab above was the Fixed Price Servicing on Vehicles 3-10 Years at participating dealers up to the end of 2019.

I see dealerships still using that pricing menu.

 

The issue was with the £289 Major Service was that £289 was getting charged even if no Fuel Filter or Air Filter was getting replaced because a Tech decided not too, 

even though the Air Filter might not get looked at.

 

As long as everything is getting not only looked at but the parts replaced.

 

*** INTERESTING TO SEE THE 24 MONTHS or 24,000 MILES. ***   

That is a new one on me as the Long Life oil, be it VW504 / 507 or VW508 / 509 is not a 24,000 Miles change service schedule.

 

Maybe a Typo on that 24,000 miles............

 

http://volkswagen.co.uk/owners/servicing/regimes

 

Edited 8 February, 20206 yr by Roottootemblowinootsoot

Sorry,  I should have pointed out that was the price I was quoted over the phone including all filters. Perhaps I'd better get it booked before the change their prices.  

I'm on variable servicing, car has covered 12k miles and it's 3rd birthday will be in June. It'll be March '21 before the 2nd variable service is due but I'll have it done early - probably October time - just b4 winter.

 

I'll have the work done by a main dealer for the same reason as yourself but I tell them to give me a price minus the pollen and air filter.  ( I told them to give me a price excluding pollen filter at 1st service which reduced price by around £40 - I bought one myself for £10 ). I don't know how much an air filter is but I fully expect to have 2nd variable carried out and have a dealer stamp in the virtual service record for £289 less pollen filter less air filter. I'm guessing around £230.

 

I won't change brake fluid until the car is approx 4yr old or whenever the brakes start to feel different - which ever comes first. 

 

As for main dealer -v- indi servicing prices, I've yet to find an indi who can beat the best main dealer price I can find ( by phoning around). And even if they did, the main dealer is more than likely to price match them.

 

My view is a main dealer service history, for at least the first six years anyway, is always looked upon favourably by the market. 

Changing brake fluid is a preventative measure.  3 years is given as the first change it was 2 years about a decade ago.

 

The reason is Brake Fluid is Hygroscopic and it is a general thing to be safe because location location location and use and miles covered might mean not much H2O in the Fluid,

then again some might have a fair bit and drive sportingly and get hot fluid and brakes, and waters boiling point is different from Brake Fluid.

 

Some might wait until the day the brakes feel different, some might test the fluid every year or 2 with a not very expensive test kit or a more expensive professional one.

Some that do track days might well change fluid and test often as the XDS / XDS+ disables when the brake system gets too hot.

1 hour ago, Roottootemblowinootsoot said:

Changing brake fluid is a preventative measure.  3 years is given as the first change it was 2 years about a decade ago.

 

The reason is Brake Fluid is Hygroscopic and it is a general thing to be safe because location location location and use and miles covered might mean not much H2O in the Fluid,

then again some might have a fair bit and drive sportingly and get hot fluid and brakes, and waters boiling point is different from Brake Fluid.

 

Some might wait until the day the brakes feel different, some might test the fluid every year or 2 with a not very expensive test kit or a more expensive professional one.

Some that do track days might well change fluid and test often as the XDS / XDS+ disables when the brake system gets too hot.

 

To cut a long story short, over the past 35yrs, I've never knowingly had the brake fluid changed in any car I've owned and never once had an issue. When I unknowingly had it changed, it could well have cost me my life.

 

The new MOT will be interesting when water content becomes part of the test. In 35yr of driving I've never known brake fluid to have been tested. They keep telling me to change every 2yr because of possible brake failure ( corroding brake pipes due to water is another good tale ) yet in all my years of driving I've never once read or heard of someones brakes failing because the brake fluid had too much water content. You'd think there'd be someone, lots of people neglect maintenence but nope, not a single one.

 

And nobody but armchair experts with their non factual dreamt up theories, can tell me why it's a 3yr fluid change from factory, but every 2yr thereafter.  In fact that information is incredibly difficult to obtain from Audi / VW and SEAT. All you're likely to find is "recommended every 2yr".

 

As the OP says, anything to do with servicing or maintaining a VAG product is uneccessarily complicated. My car is serviced and maintained according to my schedule.  

@Scot5  Long story even shorter. 

That is you and millions around the world that also never had a brake fluid change.

 

Use you common sense and know how you use your vehicles or do not use them.  Also know how long you keep your vehicles, or not.

 

PS

?

What is your actual job / profession or what are you trained and qualified as?    Not a Gas Central Heating Engineer i hope.

Edited 8 February, 20206 yr by Roottootemblowinootsoot

I have experienced both.

 

Scrapped my Octavia1 last year at 17 years old and 325000 miles and still on the original brake fluid like probably all of the other cars scrapped, it had however had the fluid content checked every year on the workshop grade tester at the Lycée pro where I am a volunteer teacher, its a motor engineering technical college with time served engineer teaching staff, every year for the telethon we have the parents put their cars through the workshop for an exhaustive check & top up which is when mine is done, TBH I began to doubt whether the guage was telling the truth but being an educational establishment it is sent of for calibration every year.

 

OTOH I had a 95 Ford Galaxy which at 3 years old repeatedly suffered from brake fade which felt just like the fluid boiling on my race car, I did drive it like it was stolen though.

 

I changed the fluid and found that the front calipers were full of water 😯😯😯 not long after the master cylinder failed through corrosion.

 

Not long after that there was a recall to change the master cylinder caps because rainwater was dripping from the scuttle & entering the fluid reservoir through the fluid level sender, of course Fords refused to pay me for the master cylinder that I had bought & fitted but they ended up having to remove the gearbox to replace the clutch slave that failed shortly after, the clutch master cylinder & they replaced my replacement master cylinder as well, they both shared the same fluid reservoir.

 

So cars can go for two lifetimes without a fluid change but if there is a fault or a way for moisture or water to get in then they can become a death trap in 3 years.

On 08/02/2020 at 21:26, Scot5 said:

 

They keep telling me to change every 2yr because of possible brake failure ( corroding brake pipes due to water is another good tale ) yet in all my years of driving I've never once read or heard of someones brakes failing because the brake fluid had too much water content. You'd think there'd be someone, lots of people neglect maintenence but nope, not a single one.

 

 

Well here's one for you. Came down Hardknott Pass and lost all brakes except the handbrake on a Cavalier due to boiling brakes. After coming down using the gears I stopped and waited for 15 minutes and the brakes came back. Changed the fluid tout suite after that. In normal use you won't normally get a problem but under heavy use, the pedal can go to the floor.

First I've heard of it. There was nothing that could be detected beforehand, it happened just like that?  Water content gradually increases in the fluid, the way you explain it, the process is like a switch - the fluid either boils or it doesn't.

 

One question - how old was the brake fluid on the Cavalier?

 

The "switch" is not the moisture suddenly appearing in the fluid but for most people at least the very uncommon occurrence of putting the brakes under extreme heavy and sustained loading, most people never drive like that and/or never have the opportunity, it comes on like a "switch" when overloaded, towing and doing a mountainous descent, or taking the vehicle on the track for the first time.

When the brakes are getting hard use and the H20 is boiling the brake system on the Skoda and other brands can then Disable TC and with VW Group cars the XDS or XDS+.

Seeing as that can happen there are those that not only change the brake fluid regularly or at least check it, they also set the XDS to off when tracking their car.

 

Trucking about for years never changing the brake fluid & just minding your own business at UK NSL's and maybe never braking that much there are likely to be no issues.  Until there are obviously.

 

 

 

 

Edited 23 February, 20206 yr by Roottootemblowinootsoot

4 hours ago, J.R. said:

The "switch" is not the moisture suddenly appearing in the fluid but for most people at least the very uncommon occurrence of putting the brakes under extreme heavy and sustained loading, most people never drive like that and/or never have the opportunity, it comes on like a "switch" when overloaded, towing and doing a mountainous descent, or taking the vehicle on the track for the first time.

 

Couldn't agree more. The problem is some bright spark started the idea it becomes a problem after 2yr.  It can't happen after 22mths apparently, but after 25mths you're going to die.

 

I've always thought the way forward is exactly what's going to happen ( at least I think / hope it is ? ) with our new MOT rules where the fluid is actually tested rather than place some time factor which for the life of me I've never been able to understand. Said it before, will say it again...  they tell me brake fluid gets changed after 2yr no matter if the car is driven by a joy riding youth in Tuscon Arizona or an elderly genleman in Tromso, Norway.  By Ms Daisy living in rural Southern Spain or her twin sister living in Central London. 

 

And I've never been able to understand why that 2yr period is taken from when the car is first registered rather than when the fluid is added at the factory. Some cars can be sitting around for ages before being sold, but for some unexplainable reason, the 2yr rule is never challenged when the car is new.  But if you then say there's no need for the fluid to be changed after 2yr, some people get very upset.       It's total bonkers when you think about it.

At three and a half years old my brake fluid boiling point was still at 210 C.

Still closer to new at 230 C than the warning / change temperature point of 155 C.

 

Can the ABS pump internals rust up if there is too much water content in the brake fluid?

 

Thanks AG Falco

Was tempted by the boil point tester linked by RTTM but could not justify the price for a DIY'er, pen ones too DIY for me so ordered one of these:

 

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000344787717.html?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.5acd4c4d8GpoUZ

 

After testing all the fluid reservoirs on my vehicles I will also test all the opened bottles of brake fluid in my workshops, garages cellar, race toolkits etc that have been around for decades in some cases, we will see if yet another bit of recieved wisdom is true or not.

AGFALCO.

 

Re re rusting.

 

I think there is quite a bit of fluid circulation in the ABS pump which should protect it, I think at the lower percentages of moisture absorbtion rust is not so much of a problem as when it can collect and seperate out usually in the lowest part of the system, the brake calipers or slave cylinders. the fluid being less dense than water

 

that was certainly the case on my Galaxy where the master cylinder was drip fed, it was virtually pure water that came out of the front brake calipers to my horror although not rusty, both master cylinders failed through rust and later on the concentric clutch slave cylinder.

Until 2010 Skoda were still showing the Brake Fluid change at 2 years first then at each 2 years for Mk 2 Fabia. Pre Face lift.

Then the Guidelines changed to first at 3 years then each 2 years.  They are only Guidelines or recommendations,  they are not even Schedules that a Full Main Dealer Serviced vehicle with a history might have had even when a Skoda Approved Used Car over 3 years old with a 12 month Warranty.

 

People can please themselves.  Up to them.  If they know best then do their worst.

 

 

 

Edited 23 February, 20206 yr by Roottootemblowinootsoot