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List of EV Tariff for 2.5p/mile motoring


wyx087

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Here's a list of EV tariffs. Octopus isn't the only game in town.

Unfortunately they all require smart meter as minimum.

 

Be careful, some of those tariff have higher day time rates.

Instead of go on comparison website to find cheapest bill, some spreadsheet work is required to find best deal for you. You need to know out how much your house uses and how much your car uses (rule of thumb can be 10k miles divide by 3.5 mi/kWh = 2850 kWh) You then find per kWh cost for each tariff and plug the tariff numbers in, day for home use, cheap rate for EV, to get a pessimistic estimate based on your usage, for each tariff.

 

 

Intelligent Octopus: 6 hr at 7.5p/kWh for everything, plus extra cheap slots to get the char charged in the morning. variable

Require compatible car or charge point

https://octopus.energy/smart/intelligent-octopus/

 

Octopus Go: 4 hr at 9.5p/kWh for everything, variable

https://octopus.energy/smart/go/

 

EOn Next drive: 7 hr at 9.5p/kWh for everything (I think), 1 yr fix

https://www.eonnext.com/tariffs/next-drive

 

OVO Charge Anytime: Only EV charging is at 10p/kWh, calculated as credit on the bill, works similar to Intelligent Octopus but end time reads like is more flexible.

Require compatible charge point

https://www.ovoenergy.com/electric-cars/charge-anytime

 

British Gas EV tariff: 5 hr at 9.4p/kWh for everything, 1 yr fix

https://www.britishgas.co.uk/energy/ev-tariff-home.html

 

EDF EV tariff: 5 hr at 8p/kWh for everything, 1 yr fix

https://www.edfenergy.com/electric-cars/tariffs

 

Please post any I've missed or new tariffs.

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Happy with my Octopus GO 4 hours of cheap, currently paying 7.5p kWh but that goes to the 9.5p per kWh middle of next month so I am charging at less than 2p per mile of driving currently.  This will be just over 2p withe the new tariff with my usual 4 miles per kWh energy consumption.

 

Simple tariff and UK most popular one I gather.

 

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Good value for a cheap pence per mile from that charge.

 

People not familiar need to think though with the 4 hour cheap tariff and a home charger they might get 28 kWh max in the 4 hours @ 9.5 pence, £2.66

& if getting 3.5 miles a kWh that is 98 miles.  nice.

 

4 hours @ 8 pence a kWh, £2.24

 

Then the 5 hours is maybe 35 kWh @ 9.4 pence £3.29 @ 122.5 miles

 

5 hours @ 8 pence £2.80

 

6 hours for 7.5 pence a kWh is pretty damn good if you are doing the miles 

42 kWh for £3.15 

& with the 3.5 miles a kWh 147 miles.   if 4 miles a kWh then 168 miles.

 

This might be of use to @Ovv& others.    

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I thought EDF at 8p/kWh off peak looks tempting if can't get Intelligent Octopus. Also move the tariff and home setup discussion away from Hubs thread into its own thread.

 

Yes, I think Intelligent Octopus is the best tariff with low day time increase (30p on standard variable to 31p for my area) and lowest cheap rate. Plus extra slots when need it. I can essentially charge my 78 kWh car from empty to full all on cheap rate, every day, thanks to their the extra allocated slots system. I don't do the miles to ever need it, but I keep smart charging turned on so they can choose when they charge my car and help with grid demands. Because many tariff starts at 0am and most popular GO tariff starts at 0:30, if not needed, IO often doesn't charge between 0-1am. Doesn't bother me when it charges as I asleep.

 

 

 

In the other thread, @lol-lol, you said your 4 kWh battery is portable. Are you powering your house with it? Or is it an isolated setup and you plug in appliances to discharge it?

I like the idea of portable battery so I can take it elsewhere for electricity. But I don't like the idea of manually managing its use. If there's a solution to just plug into the domestic mains ring and it'll automatically draw or discharge based on solar excess (eg. taps into smart meter zigbee HAN)

 

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5 hours ago, wyx087 said:

I thought EDF at 8p/kWh off peak looks tempting if can't get Intelligent Octopus. Also move the tariff and home setup discussion away from Hubs thread into its own thread.

 

Yes, I think Intelligent Octopus is the best tariff with low day time increase (30p on standard variable to 31p for my area) and lowest cheap rate. Plus extra slots when need it. I can essentially charge my 78 kWh car from empty to full all on cheap rate, every day, thanks to their the extra allocated slots system. I don't do the miles to ever need it, but I keep smart charging turned on so they can choose when they charge my car and help with grid demands. Because many tariff starts at 0am and most popular GO tariff starts at 0:30, if not needed, IO often doesn't charge between 0-1am. Doesn't bother me when it charges as I asleep.

 

In the other thread, @lol-lol, you said your 4 kWh battery is portable. Are you powering your house with it? Or is it an isolated setup and you plug in appliances to discharge it?

I like the idea of portable battery so I can take it elsewhere for electricity. But I don't like the idea of manually managing its use. If there's a solution to just plug into the domestic mains ring and it'll automatically draw or discharge based on solar excess (eg. taps into smart meter zigbee HAN)

 

 

I have a 1.8 kWh Bluetti EB1800, good lithium iron phosphate battery but only a 1k inverted and only charging at 210W via the charging brick, or solar mostly at the moment of a three 120W panel series linked and then a 1.5 kwh Allpowers with a 2.4 kw inverter and that can charge at up to 1.5 kw plus I have numerous 400, 200 and 100 wh solar generator batteries.

 

The main purpose for the two larger solar generators is to supply the fridge freezer which seems to take about 3 kwh a day so by far the largest electric consuming items.  I usually have the smaller ie 400 wh batteries power the laptop all day and I have a single solar panel to charge the battery not being used.  I should get the router, and then when the telly and sky box is on but apart from the telly I do not think much in the house uses much lecky at all.   

 

With day time lecky becoming much cheaper soon I am going to be even less motivated to be bothered to keep faffing about with using batteries and hence just use them when I feel like it ie I am at hope and can be bothered.

 

I think fridge makers should build in batteries to only run on the cheap lecky, from what I see you could easily save a hundred quid or more a year if fridge freezer have this built in.    

Nice to have the backup power if case of outage.  These battery devices are getting cheaper and cheaper and now under 50p per wh even when bundled with decent inverters and solar generators. 

 

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Semi-rated news, Octopus are increasing export tariff, switching people from government SEG 4.1p/kWh to their own tariff that pays 15p/kWh. 

It is available to people on Intelligent Octopus, where overnight off-peak import is 7.5p/kWh. 

https://www.speakev.com/threads/outgoing-octopus-increase-great-news.179902/

https://www.speakev.com/threads/octopus-seg.179905/

 

So import 6 hours x 7kW (42kWh) at 7.5p overnight then export it at 15p. Easy £3.15 profit every day. 

 

May be time for me to upgrade to a 60 kWh Leaf. £1000 per year to help with paying it off, by itself :D

(my Leaf V2H install is finally booked in for end of October) 

Edited by wyx087
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Unless this is a change in terms and conditions, what you propose is specifically excluded on the 15p export tariff for this reason.  If you are on IO or Go, you will be on the Agile export tariff.  This os how I understood the T&Cs when I signed up. 

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On 31/08/2023 at 15:03, lol-lol said:

to supply the fridge freezer which seems to take about 3 kwh a day so by far the largest electric consuming items.

 

On 31/08/2023 at 15:03, lol-lol said:

I think fridge makers should build in batteries to only run on the cheap lecky, from what I see you could easily save a hundred quid or more a year if fridge freezer have this built in.   

 

How old is your fridge freezer?

 

I was susrprised how little power is consumed by a newer one, I treated myself to a new one 2 years ago which was largely paid for by selling the previous Samsung, it was the cheapest model and the only one available from stock that would fit under the gas boiler, at the time I was getting free leccy and gas in the UK so did not measure its consumption. It had an average energy rating, many others were allegedly much better.

 

Here in France I have it on a smartplug, first surprise was how little the compressor cut in (but it was autumn) and that it was only pulling 50 watts when it did, the monthly consumption was between 4 and 5kwh from November to Feb then started climbing as the temperatures rose, it was up to 19 kwh in July by which time I had it switched to the highest setting, July and August were 24 and 25kwh.

 

The last few days readings in the heatwave have been between 0.84 and 0.97 kwh, highest evr consumption was 1.15kwh in August when the temperatures were over 40°c and on those days the door is opened multiple times to drink from or refill the 2 chilled bottles of water I keep in there.

 

So I reckon you could reduce your consumption by at least a third if you buy a newer freezer assuming yours are older, I reckon mine will cost €25-30 per year to run so your claim to save a hundred quid a year using a battery tells me you are consuming far more than you need be.

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27 minutes ago, Luckypants said:

Unless this is a change in terms and conditions, what you propose is specifically excluded on the 15p export tariff for this reason.  If you are on IO or Go, you will be on the Agile export tariff.  This os how I understood the T&Cs when I signed up. 

People in those thread says T&C have now been updated to include IO. And indeed it has.

https://octopus.energy/policies/smart-tariffs-terms-and-condition/

 

image.png.4178c4893c170252d31974f402f07482.png

 

 

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3 hours ago, J.R. said:

 

 

How old is your fridge freezer?

I was susrprised how little power is consumed by a newer one, I treated myself to a new one 2 years ago which was largely paid for by selling the previous Samsung, it was the cheapest model and the only one available from stock that would fit under the gas boiler, at the time I was getting free leccy and gas in the UK so did not measure its consumption. It had an average energy rating, many others were allegedly much better.

Here in France I have it on a smartplug, first surprise was how little the compressor cut in (but it was autumn) and that it was only pulling 50 watts when it did, the monthly consumption was between 4 and 5kwh from November to Feb then started climbing as the temperatures rose, it was up to 19 kwh in July by which time I had it switched to the highest setting, July and August were 24 and 25kwh.

The last few days readings in the heatwave have been between 0.84 and 0.97 kwh, highest evr consumption was 1.15kwh in August when the temperatures were over 40°c and on those days the door is opened multiple times to drink from or refill the 2 chilled bottles of water I keep in there.

So I reckon you could reduce your consumption by at least a third if you buy a newer freezer assuming yours are older, I reckon mine will cost €25-30 per year to run so your claim to save a hundred quid a year using a battery tells me you are consuming far more than you need be.

 

I reckon it is at least 10 years old but possibly much older than that, could be 15 or so and I would not been surprised.  Checked my Octopus Go records and when I was away and there was nobody in the house and only the fridge freezer was on, plus a couple of energy efficient lights the daily bill was about £1.05 so fair the fridge freezer is the lion's share at a pound a day.   But this is when I am not home and can do some energy management.

 

Downloading 2 kwh in to the solar generators during the 7.5p per kWh period 0030 to 0430, generating some solar during the day, sometimes 0.5 to 0.75 kwh mean I am running the fridge for about 15p a day rather a £1 which is fine but yes I do think I could get a fridge of similar size ie 1.8m tall and standard width which probably uses say half to two thirds the power.

 

It is going to be less worthwhile doing anything in ten days time as my Octopus day rate for electricity drops from 40p per kWh to 29p per kWh so I will be less bothered but then I will also get very little solar but also my nighttime rate is going up from 7.5p per kwh to 9.5 per kWh so much less incentive to faff around ie now can save myself a quid but from the electricity tariff changes it might be around 50p but certainly very much less.  I will continue to charge the Zoe up in the cheap lecky power time but cannot see it being worth messing around with the fridge but I may look at getting a new fridge perhaps in the black friday events.

 

Octopus Go still the right tariff for me I think and with Octopus acquiring Shell electricity supply contracts Octopus will be no 2 in the UK, might even move my broadband to them and Octopus Electroverse scheme for discounted public EV charging is a plus but it is looking like TESLA could blow even Octopus out of the water with their new V4 chargers and tariffs so low that charging at home, outside the 4 hour cheap window, could well be cheaper at the V4 chargers, what is cheaper than free ?

 

Sister very happy with her EDF fixed energy contract, which she got for 3 years a couple of years ago, must have cost nationally owned EDF many millions in selling energy cheaper than they can generate it, I am sure my sister would like to thanks the French government and people for that subsidy.

 

In the UK the next 1.4 Gw power link from Scandinavia has been turned on, after the Norwegian one a year or two ago this is a Danish link.  I would have thought Germany would buy all the spare lecky Denmark could generate but that is now more than half again as to what they need so presumably the Danes can get a better price off the Brits.

 

It is clear to see that electricity can be generated on a ever decreasing, in real terms, per unit cost and I just hope that translates to the consumer although, as I said above, if it is so cheap then I am less likely to buy a new fridge which is not so good for climate change I suppose.  I gather UK Grid is going to work with Octopus again this winter and we will have saving sessions where we basically can get back ten times the cost of power if we do not use a certain peak times ie when the wind is not blowing at the North Sea wind farms are not producing the GWs of power they can and the French and other interconnectors cannot supply all UK needs.   

 

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6 hours ago, lol-lol said:

I gather UK Grid is going to work with Octopus again this winter and we will have saving sessions where we basically can get back ten times the cost of power if we do not use a certain peak times ie when the wind is not blowing at the North Sea wind farms are not producing the GWs of power they can and the French and other interconnectors cannot supply all UK needs.   

Yes, happening again this year: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/09/01/national-grid-pay-households-cut-electricity-usage-12-times/

It's from the grid and should apply to all suppliers.

 

Perfect timing as I get my V2H installed :D Should be able to bring it down to 0 kWh over that period without doing anything.

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10 hours ago, lol-lol said:

Sister very happy with her EDF fixed energy contract, which she got for 3 years a couple of years ago, must have cost nationally owned EDF many millions in selling energy cheaper than they can generate it

Same here. Signed up for 3 year fixed rated in Late September 21. Deal went from their website within 7 days. Presently paying EDF less than they pay for gas and electricity. They paid me more than I paid them in January this year. Refund for less use and government subsidy. Trying to build up a large credit now due to lower use so when the fixed tariff ends it won't be a big shock. Had to have smart meters fitted to get the tariff but these don't work so I have to supply the meter readings.

 

Thanks. AG Falco

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6 hours ago, wyx087 said:

Yes, happening again this year: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2023/09/01/national-grid-pay-households-cut-electricity-usage-12-times/

It's from the grid and should apply to all suppliers.

Perfect timing as I get my V2H installed :D Should be able to bring it down to 0 kWh over that period without doing anything.

 

I think I will keep my setup the flexible low tech way and it is just what to add to my Allpowers and Bluetti setup.  Bjorn Nyland loves his Ecoflow and Ecoflow extra battery when he does his drive an EV until it dies then get the Ecoflows out of the boot, connects the Granny cable and tries to revive the EV but these "solar Generator/ battery/ inverter" thing-me-a-bobs can go by ones large consumption devices at home or in the boot of the car and certainly will come with me when I move to my castle in Wales when I go in to survivor mode.

 

Question is what box to get next.  Looking at around 3 kwh, 3 kw DC to AC inverter and circa 1 kW solar controller and to pay less well than 50p per Wh/W battery/inverter ie about a grand or thereabouts.

 

    

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There's a small trial by Podpoint in Scotland to utilise EV smart charging to avoid shutting off wind farms:

https://www.speakev.com/threads/pod-point-flex.179959/

 

Quote

If you’re eligible and you decide to sign-up, we’ll send you an email a couple of times a week. Plug in and charge at least half of those times and we’ll give you a £25 Amazon voucher in the Spring.

 

Scotland sometimes generates more electricity than it can consume or export over the border. When there’s nowhere for this excess wind energy to go, Scottish wind farms must be paid to “curtail” their generation, which means they’re being paid to shut down and stop producing energy. But we think there’s a better way to make use of this energy and save us all money, by instead rewarding our customers for charging during these periods of excess energy.

So, as a Scottish Pod Point customer, between September 2023 and March 2024, you could be rewarded for plugging in and charging on days when there's an abundance of wind energy.

 

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Thank you, i will check it out and try to get on-board.

 

This week i have had 20 kWh from Podpoint at Tesco for free gratis. 

Somehow with the MINI on the 7 kW post i get 2 kWh in between 5 & 10 minutes. 

Very strange but better than when i was plugging in every 15 minutes 2 or 3 times as i did with the Corsa when they stopped giving away free electricity and it went to 15 mins limit before being cut off. 

 

I could easily go and plug in and pay 44 pence a kWh for the sake of a voucher, but really the tariff is a rip-off.

 

My Podpoint account shows i used my app / account Oct & November 2022

but then not again till June 2023 when i used up my credit.

Between times i paid by card a few times at a PodPoint,s at LIDL.   I used a PodPoint Rapid @ Tesco on the 25th August and it was too expensive.

I had planned on using LIDL Podpoints when away later this year if they are still below 50 pence a kWh.

Edited by toot
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I think it's only available to those with podpoint charge points at home and with smart meter, from new posts in the thread I linked. It's also not clear if the charging is free or not. But there is a possibility other smart charge point supplier may participate.

 

TBH this is the idea with Intelligent Octopus, only charging EV when there's higher amount of renewables. But IO is not as directly linked to renewable excess as it could have, the messaging is more focused on car usability.

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There is a very quick grown number of light commercial EV Vans, Taxi / Minibuses & Private MPV,s around now and with 75 kWh plus sized batteries and these might be getting parked up at 7 or 11 kW AC chargers but more are needing charged during journeys or during the working day, maybe over a lunch time or before heading home to park up and ready for the next day. 

 

Around my local vicinity and on my travels these are doing lots of sitting on chargers 'Long time mister'.

 

Lots of Polestar hire cars around Scotland and the hirers seem amazed that they are only getting on a 50 kW possible, and possibly not.

 

Then there are these ridiculous Range Extender Taxis and Commercials like even the PodPoint techs have that do not have 22 kW AC charging and these techs are supposed to travel the likes of a couple of hundred miles from the Perth / Dundee area all the way north.  (Each way a couple of hundred miles.)

 

A bit of a horlicks sadly.   

Good that the southern areas are improving because the top 1/4 of the British Mainland is not.

 

I have not asked people what the Polestar costs to hire in the Central belt but if they get on CPS chargers they are paying 55 pence a kWh around there, 

then from around 35, 41, 47 pence in the different council areas and by the time they are at Inverness & North / Highland Region 87 pence a kWh. 

 

Why you would take a EV i have no idea, but then maybe they believe there are more free chargers. 

 

Getting on commercial chargers & ultra rapid will be 62 pence, 70 or 75 pence and up to 79 pence even £1 a kWh.

Edited by toot
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6 hours ago, toot said:

Why you would take a EV i have no idea, but then maybe they believe there are more free chargers. 

I know paywall and USA, but it gave a few reasons, such as vehicle "upgrade" and curiosity to test EV.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/travel/electric-vehicle-rentals-tesla-hertz-38ecd430

 

Personally, I'd want an EV for the better drive. Also I'm used to "the search". I've set arbitrary limit of about 20% extra rental cost to get EV's during family holiday.

We, as family, decided Norway for next summer. So I'll be renting an EV next year. 🤞

 

 

I've made a poll on SpeakEV to see if people seek out to rent EV's:

https://www.speakev.com/threads/would-you-look-to-rent-an-ev-during-family-holiday.179998/

 

Edited by wyx087
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I would use a Tesla in Norway or an i3 since that is the cars family have to lend.  (i cant drive Left Hand Drive though, the roads and my brain is the issue, not the cars.)

I would use a Polestar in Scotland if getting one, but then there is plenty charging facilities for charging, but sadly not easy enough for those hiring to get to and use it seems be it with the cars sat nav or the Charge Place Scotland App which most are looking at while trying to figure out why chargers will not start when they press START CHARGE.

Usually it is because it is GREY and not BLUE. 

Communications poor and the Charger / System thinks the last user is still on it, or there is another issue.  They end up doing the charger dance if there are other chargers to use.

I tell them when there is a Contactless payment option'  use that not the App.  In some cases they have no CPS account anyway so can not use the app to start chargers.

So i have shown people how to register a card for payment and as quick as i can exolain to someone in the car how it works and that they might need to find PodPoints or InstaVolt or even a BP Pulse.  & these BP Pulse they are trying in Edinburgh are CPS but tap the card and you are paying the Edinburgh City 55 pence tariff. It is easier / quicker / more chance of the charger starting.

 

.............

This looks good.

Free to charge. Available.  START CHARGE.

The thing is it is occupied,. by me and it was a RFID / CPS card that started it.

Usually it is GREY and can not be started with an APP even when un-occupied. 

 

DSCN3581.JPG

Edited by toot
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Octopus GO-22-07-05  tariff

 

Well my electricity tariff changes tomorrow, 17th of September so a one quarter drop in my daytime rate but just over a quarter rise in my super cheap night time rate.   Standing Charge become £191 a year, wow, £16 a month just about up from £14.50, up over 11%, a larger rise than UK inflation (CPI) was at its peak.  Of course RPI was 14% in the UK in Nov 2022.

 

Just completed my final cheap charge for the Zoe. Now showing 226 miles range and 100% charge, do not usually charge it much above 80% to help the life of the lithium battery but off to South Wales in a couple of hours.   So if I work on the 4 miles per kWh then my energy prices is going from 1.875 p per mile to a whopping 2.375 p per kWh, wow, big increase and only just under the 2.5 p per kWh.  Of course I will regen some power on my journeys, often see several kWh regen'd in the use of my 52 kWh battery so that as that is "free" energy that can bring down my mileage cost.  Even having now about 15k on the Zoe I think the battery state of health is still upper 90% and going carefully I think I can still get 240 miles or more between charges. 

 

Driving and using that first 10% of battery just have to keep reminding myself I will not get the full up to 30 kWs of regen so have to drive more thoughtfully.  It will stay at 100% for the first ten miles or so I expect and this is where the miles travelled plus range predicted can easily equal 240 or 250 miles.  Zoes are know to be able to go more than ten miles beyond zero before going in to turtle mode.  Still very happy with the Zoe.  It does pref 60 mph cruising than 70 mph, big difference of energy consumption.  As I only get 4 hours cheap and only have a 3.6 kw charger I only get 14 kW per charging session ie about 56 miles but that has been OK but I suppose charging in the day is not so bad any more ie less than 7.5 p per mile which is cheaper than any ICE car energy costs which I reckon are at least 9 p per miles so might do some preconditions charges just before a long winter journey, whilst connected to the mains as well as the night charging of course.   Should be better off as although I use more electricity in the 4 hours than the 20 hours the Octopus calculator still reckons I will be about a tenner a month better off on the new electricity rate and with gas going down about 10% in October 2023 all looking good.

 

Electricity
Day rate 40.06p per kWh
 
Night rate 7.50p per kWh
 
Standing charge 47.86p per day

 

From 12 am (is that midnight or midday ?)  nonsense really, one cannot have apres or post midi if it is exactly 12 o'clock) 

 

Electricity
Day rate 29.90p per kWh
 
Night rate 9.50p per kWh
 
Standing charge 52.32p per day

 

 

Edited by lol-lol
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2 hours ago, wyx087 said:

Good news. Octopus go is now 9p per kWh off peak. 

 

Check it tomorrow as I am still on the 7.5p per kWh today but it is suppose to change to 9.5p per kWh tomorrow, I thought they might hold me to the 9.5 p per kWh but then it is a variable rate I see rather than a 1 year fixed rate I have had until today.

 

I will take it.  I wonder what is a "reasonable" period of notice of a change in price rate, upwards, a month, three months  ?

 

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1 hour ago, wyx087 said:

Check on their website, it’s showing 9p for me. 
https://octopus.energy/smart/go/

 

I did and ir showed 7.5p per kwh but this the day of my fixed price year long so it will be interesting what it shows tomorrow ie 17th September when I start the variable Go rate.

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12 hours ago, wyx087 said:

Check on their website, it’s showing 9p for me. 
https://octopus.energy/smart/go/

 

Yep, showing 9 pence per kWh instead of 9.5 p per kWh for the 4 hour cheaper time 0030 to 0430, hope they keep it that or less through winter and in to next year.

 

Assuming 90% charging efficiency that would be 9.9/ 4 miles per kWH so just under 2.5 p per kWh.  Actually managed 4.5 miles per kWh going down to South Wales, not slow but not at the limit, and maybe above on the speedo occasionally, but down to just over 4 miles per kWh coming back to Worcester and arrived home with 25% after the 160 mile round trip with about 30 miles in to Newport to go with daughter to Halfords to get a bunch of European driving items.

 

Did pop in to the new Osprey bank of chargers just off the motorway at Maygor between Newport Gwent and the  Severn bridges and plugged in to one of those chargers just to see it works OK and lob in some of my free Electroverse credit in to the Zoe.  Forgot that at already 65% SOC the charge rate would only be 30 kW but hey ho.  Only put in 2,5 kW ie ten miles worth, cost about £1.60, still in credit with Electoverse.    Subway there but had just used one in Newport.

 

As always very happy with Octopus rates and all aspects of their business and be interesting to see what happens now that they have bought lost of customers over from Shell for home electricity and Broadband making them the second biggest supplier in the UK now after Centrica ie BG.  Rock on Greg.

 

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