Torque Or Bhp?

Real Skoda · 01-10-2003, 15:14

At the moment I have a dilemma, do I buy a Fabia vRS or an Octavia vRS?

Both would be given a remap (I gather Jabba is the prefered supplier for Octavia remaps, but who for the Fabia?). One would give big horsepower, the other would give a nice wave of torque. Which would you go for and why?

I like the idea of big torque in a small car, but I'm also tempted by the high top end that the Octavia could give in horsepower terms.

Decisions, decisions

***ncarring*** · 01-10-2003, 15:54

Since you are obviously loaded, Real Skoda, why not buy both, and use them on alternate weekends? :p

Real Skoda · 01-10-2003, 15:59

Nick, not loaded

Just need to get the wifwe a new car (which I will probably end up driving to and from work). Define loaded? I have 4 cars at present, 1 BMW M5 (6 months old, company car), 1 mk 3 Golf VR6 (wife's car) and 2 old Skodas rotting away peacefully (bought on a whim, used to rally a 130 and wanted to recapture my youth so bought 2, 1 sound body, 1 sound drivetrain and was hoping to amalgamate them)

So torque or bhp?

sihorton · 01-10-2003, 16:00

Get a car that has both torque & bhp rather than compromising on one or the other

si

Stimps · 01-10-2003, 16:00

Fabias are definitely a lot more fun than Octavias. Get yourself the fab vRS and a remap and you'll be able to wave at the octy owners as you coast past them...

chrish · 01-10-2003, 16:02

I would love to have both, the Fabia for fast, comfortable journeys at 50mpg and the Octi for real performance and good handling (after a few mods of course). The Octi can carry a lot more stuff and that is great advantage for me.
What is your main useage going to be?
Chris

Stimps · 01-10-2003, 16:04

Chris,

Why do you think the octavia vRS gives better handling than a (lowered) Fabia? Personally I like a small car you can throw around and be able to see out the rear window properly when reversing!

(Lowered so it's on a level playing field with the RS - excuse the pun!)

FabiaTDi · 01-10-2003, 16:07

A Jabba'd Octy vRS would be quicker in outright acceleration terms, but a Jabba'd Fabia vRS wouldnt be far behind. You cant really argue with well over 300lb/ft in a lightish car.

The good thing about the Fabia is that it will be cheap to run (not that the Octy RS is expensive mind!)

My Jabba'd TDi doesnt hang around, so imagine what an extra 50bhp and 50lb/ft torque would do!

The engine in the Octy woudl have better scope for tuning if you wanted to go further than a remap.

Thats my humble opinion anyway!

chrish · 01-10-2003, 16:16

Steve,
The vRS Fabia I drove leaned on corners rather than cornered. In its basic vRS form it doesn't feel as well sorted handling-wise as the vRS Octi. On the other hand the steering felt quicker than the Octi.
Chris

Stimps · 01-10-2003, 16:21

I think the fab needs proper lowering (not the 15mm drop for the fab RS) and it might be better...

The octy RS does feel very solid though, I admit

devonutopia · 01-10-2003, 16:34

I'd go for torque, but then I'm biased aren't I. However, there's nothing quite like a roaring 1.8, turbo whistling away, revving beyond 6500RPM. I'm not much into high revs, so prefer the subtle torque of a highly powered / tuned diesel.

redbaron · 01-10-2003, 16:46

have both.. get a v8 busa engine... (in CCC this month) and twin turbo it.. revs torque d/v whistle.. perfect.

devonutopia · 01-10-2003, 16:50

Audi RS6 must be pretty decent in both areas? 4.2 V8 and TT? Saw one at Cannonball but it didn't seem that impressive - being driven conservatively I thought.

***Neo_VR*** · 01-10-2003, 18:50

Torque and BHP... Fabia vRS!
with the money you save on fuel and insurance get it jabbad, lowered and airfilter and zorst. and youll give even chipped octys a run for their money!

MonkeyHanger · 01-10-2003, 19:01

Quote:

Originally posted by devonutopia in this post
Audi RS6 must be pretty decent in both areas? 4.2 V8 and TT? Saw one at Cannonball but it didn't seem that impressive - being driven conservatively I thought.

Jason,

remember the safety Car from Oulton Park ?

now THAT'S how to drive an RS6

Real Skoda · 01-10-2003, 19:47

Quote:

Why do you think the octavia vRS gives better handling

Looking at the 2 cars and having driven both, albeit only for test drives, I would say that out of the box and with no mods the Octavia has better handling and a better ride. The wife however isn't convinced, she is more concerned with parking the damned thing than how it goes round corners

I did point out that parking sensors for those who are challenged in the car handling and spacial awareness department. The only reply I got was a slap!

Will Skoda ever do a Superb vRS? What a beast that would be! I'm sure even my sales guys could be convinced then (provided they added coat hooks

)

***DGW*** · 03-10-2003, 08:36

Why not buy a 4X4 Estate and have it tuned by Jabba to give plenty of torque? You've then got the best of lots of worlds, including cheaper insurance than a vRS (Group 13 v Group 16).

Real Skoda · 03-10-2003, 08:42

A good point Mr DGW, sir. However, my wife is none of the following: a vet, a farmer or an agricultural vehicle fetishist, as she so delightfully pointed out to me. I won't post her exact words, but I get the impression that its not a viable alternative although I did point out that it is available in a very nice shade of blue and that it would match one of her handbags very nicely.

**GAFF** · 03-10-2003, 17:22

Quote:

Originally posted by MonkeyHanger in this post
Jason,

remember the safety Car from Oulton Park ?

now THAT'S how to drive an RS6

I heard a story that during one of the GT races it was raining and the safety car (RS6 ) was called out, as it was lapping one of the cars had to radio his pit crew to get them to slow it down as he couldn't keep up (must have been on dry tires).

The RS6 is a beautiful machine.

devonutopia · 03-10-2003, 19:36

I remember the RS6s and the noise they made very well, Geoff.

The one at Cannonball was whispering in comparison to those two at Oulton...

edit: Will Zorst work on a TDI?

VRS_Barry · 04-10-2003, 00:57

Quote:

Audi RS6 must be pretty decent in both areas? 4.2 V8 and TT? Saw one at Cannonball but it didn't seem that impressive - being driven conservatively I thought.

Bought one when they came out at first and had it tuned by Star Performance to 520bhp with 478lbft - In a traight line it was awesome dam quick but it was way way to heavy for the twisties and the auto box was rubbish and would always kick down at the wrong time (eg. mid bend) Prior to my RS6 I had an RS4 and to this day that was the best car I ever owned - miss it like hell - I would have another RS4 but even the newest ones are almost 3 years old now ...... ooops talk about off topic.... I'll shut up.

Anyway a well chipped vRS octavia should be making around 280lb ft of torque anyway which is pretty good. I reckon there will be some problems chipping the fabia vRS though due to the stupid tailpipe design. More or less evry tdi has twin downward facing tailpipes which means that the soot that a chipped diesel produces more of just gets bounced onto the road. Not on the fabia vRS though. When we chipped our one we achieved about 195bhp with 304lbft but the car was far too smokey for road use (you would get pulled!) So the map had to be altered giving in the end 185bhp with 287lbft. But it still is a little smokey. So in my opinion its easier to get more from a tavia AND it will be quicker due to the high bhp top end and good torque figure. phew!

VRS_Barry · 04-10-2003, 01:00

Anyway torque and bhp are nothing unless they are produced effectively and at the right time. Alot of remaps available for the 1.8t engines have a boost spike in the map which gives you that pin you back in the seat surge of power feeling but does little to help the overall performance of the car.

What you want is a smooth curve to a high torque figure which should be held for as long as possible throughout the rev range. High HP is nice too for top end!!

devonutopia · 04-10-2003, 10:25

Barry - You don't know a guy called Steve Murray, a director of a blinds company from Livingston? - I'm aware he now runs around in an RS6 too, after progressing from a Nissan Skyline.

(He's a customer of my Dad's company)

VRS_Barry · 04-10-2003, 11:59

I know of 1 other rs6 in scotland and it's a black one with red interior comes from somewhere about edinburgh....

01-10-2003, 15:14	#1
Real Skoda BANNED Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Southend Posts: 522 Thanks: 0 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts	Torque Or Bhp? At the moment I have a dilemma, do I buy a Fabia vRS or an Octavia vRS? Both would be given a remap (I gather Jabba is the prefered supplier for Octavia remaps, but who for the Fabia?). One would give big horsepower, the other would give a nice wave of torque. Which would you go for and why? I like the idea of big torque in a small car, but I'm also tempted by the high top end that the Octavia could give in horsepower terms. Decisions, decisions

01-10-2003, 15:54	#2
*ncarring* Don't talk, drive! Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: The B roads of Britain Posts: 12,949 Thanks: 16 Thanked 94 Times in 77 Posts	Since you are obviously loaded, Real Skoda, why not buy both, and use them on alternate weekends? :p __________________ Nick North Wiltshire RoADAR

01-10-2003, 16:00	#4
sihorton Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: lancashire Posts: 451 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Get a car that has both torque & bhp rather than compromising on one or the other si __________________ :drive: I'm going for the gap... "crunch"

01-10-2003, 16:00	#5
Stimps Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Colchester Posts: 5,091 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Fabias are definitely a lot more fun than Octavias. Get yourself the fab vRS and a remap and you'll be able to wave at the octy owners as you coast past them... __________________ Steve « Nature Green 1.4 16v Fabia Comfort »

01-10-2003, 16:04	#7
Stimps Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Colchester Posts: 5,091 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Chris, Why do you think the octavia vRS gives better handling than a (lowered) Fabia? Personally I like a small car you can throw around and be able to see out the rear window properly when reversing! (Lowered so it's on a level playing field with the RS - excuse the pun!) __________________ Steve « Nature Green 1.4 16v Fabia Comfort »

01-10-2003, 15:59	#3
Real Skoda BANNED Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Southend Posts: 522 Thanks: 0 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts	Nick, not loaded Just need to get the wifwe a new car (which I will probably end up driving to and from work). Define loaded? I have 4 cars at present, 1 BMW M5 (6 months old, company car), 1 mk 3 Golf VR6 (wife's car) and 2 old Skodas rotting away peacefully (bought on a whim, used to rally a 130 and wanted to recapture my youth so bought 2, 1 sound body, 1 sound drivetrain and was hoping to amalgamate them) So torque or bhp?

01-10-2003, 16:02	#6
chrish Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 557 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I would love to have both, the Fabia for fast, comfortable journeys at 50mpg and the Octi for real performance and good handling (after a few mods of course). The Octi can carry a lot more stuff and that is great advantage for me. What is your main useage going to be? Chris

01-10-2003, 16:07	#8
FabiaTDi VT5 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Warwickshire Posts: 2,016 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	A Jabba'd Octy vRS would be quicker in outright acceleration terms, but a Jabba'd Fabia vRS wouldnt be far behind. You cant really argue with well over 300lb/ft in a lightish car. The good thing about the Fabia is that it will be cheap to run (not that the Octy RS is expensive mind!) My Jabba'd TDi doesnt hang around, so imagine what an extra 50bhp and 50lb/ft torque would do! The engine in the Octy woudl have better scope for tuning if you wanted to go further than a remap. Thats my humble opinion anyway! __________________ Was: 2003 Allard Tuned Fabia vRS VT5 Turbo Conversion Now: 2008 Audi A3 Sportback TDI

01-10-2003, 16:16	#9
chrish Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 557 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Steve, The vRS Fabia I drove leaned on corners rather than cornered. In its basic vRS form it doesn't feel as well sorted handling-wise as the vRS Octi. On the other hand the steering felt quicker than the Octi. Chris

01-10-2003, 16:21	#10
Stimps Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Colchester Posts: 5,091 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I think the fab needs proper lowering (not the 15mm drop for the fab RS) and it might be better... The octy RS does feel very solid though, I admit __________________ Steve « Nature Green 1.4 16v Fabia Comfort »

01-10-2003, 16:34	#11
devonutopia Mongreller Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Exeter / Devon Posts: 30,070 Images: 5 Thanks: 76 Thanked 346 Times in 289 Posts	I'd go for torque, but then I'm biased aren't I. However, there's nothing quite like a roaring 1.8, turbo whistling away, revving beyond 6500RPM. I'm not much into high revs, so prefer the subtle torque of a highly powered / tuned diesel. __________________ Jason - Mongrel owner! WOOOOF! Grrrrr Custom Fabia Bonnet Lifter Kits - £45! Click Me. Cheesy bonnet lifter video to "raise me up" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMnGECEi5Oc See the mongrel's 260bhp Dyno Video!

01-10-2003, 16:46	#12
redbaron Briskodian Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 9,559 Thanks: 15 Thanked 69 Times in 60 Posts	have both.. get a v8 busa engine... (in CCC this month) and twin turbo it.. revs torque d/v whistle.. perfect. __________________ ________________________________________ Some times I just feel like smiling.

01-10-2003, 16:50	#13
devonutopia Mongreller Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Exeter / Devon Posts: 30,070 Images: 5 Thanks: 76 Thanked 346 Times in 289 Posts	Audi RS6 must be pretty decent in both areas? 4.2 V8 and TT? Saw one at Cannonball but it didn't seem that impressive - being driven conservatively I thought. __________________ Jason - Mongrel owner! WOOOOF! Grrrrr Custom Fabia Bonnet Lifter Kits - £45! Click Me. Cheesy bonnet lifter video to "raise me up" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMnGECEi5Oc See the mongrel's 260bhp Dyno Video!

01-10-2003, 18:50	#14
*Neo_VR* Om nom nom nom Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Manchester Posts: 12,418 Thanks: 77 Thanked 176 Times in 125 Posts	Torque and BHP... Fabia vRS! with the money you save on fuel and insurance get it jabbad, lowered and airfilter and zorst. and youll give even chipped octys a run for their money! __________________ ColGod the UberMod ,___, [O.o] /)__) -"--"- ORLY??

03-10-2003, 08:36	#17
*DGW* BRISKODA Staff Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Cambridgeshire Posts: 17,259 Thanks: 51 Thanked 197 Times in 149 Posts	Why not buy a 4X4 Estate and have it tuned by Jabba to give plenty of torque? You've then got the best of lots of worlds, including cheaper insurance than a vRS (Group 13 v Group 16). __________________ Denis 2002 Octavia 1.8T 4X4 turbo Estate - rebreathed on by Jabba ... 31.93mpg 2007 Fabia vRS - CC, ESP and full leather trim by Seat Surgeons ...48.57 mpg...

04-10-2003, 11:59	#24
VRS_Barry Briskodian Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Glasgow Posts: 100 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I know of 1 other rs6 in scotland and it's a black one with red interior comes from somewhere about edinburgh.... __________________ Misano Red MTM Audi RS4 Star Performance Custom Tuning 548bhp 664Nm, Sports Manifolds, Milltek + 100 Cell Race Cats, Movit Brakes, 19" Bi-Motos, H&R PSC Coilover Kit Silver Fabia VRS Hybrid Turbo Conversion, Milltek Exhaust and Cat, BMC Carbon Air Box, FMIC, Seat Sport Strut Brace, Brembos, KW Coilovers, Mille Miglia MM-S 17's, Custom Leather, Sat Nav Red Fabia 1.4TDI Estate Star Performance DPT Tuned 107bhp/170lbft, VRS Wheels, Eibach Springs

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03-10-2003, 08:42	#18
Real Skoda BANNED Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Southend Posts: 522 Thanks: 0 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts	A good point Mr DGW, sir. However, my wife is none of the following: a vet, a farmer or an agricultural vehicle fetishist, as she so delightfully pointed out to me. I won't post her exact words, but I get the impression that its not a viable alternative although I did point out that it is available in a very nice shade of blue and that it would match one of her handbags very nicely.

03-10-2003, 19:36	#20
devonutopia Mongreller Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Exeter / Devon Posts: 30,070 Images: 5 Thanks: 76 Thanked 346 Times in 289 Posts	I remember the RS6s and the noise they made very well, Geoff. The one at Cannonball was whispering in comparison to those two at Oulton... edit: Will Zorst work on a TDI? __________________ Jason - Mongrel owner! WOOOOF! Grrrrr Custom Fabia Bonnet Lifter Kits - £45! Click Me. Cheesy bonnet lifter video to "raise me up" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMnGECEi5Oc See the mongrel's 260bhp Dyno Video! Last edited by devonutopia; 03-10-2003 at 19:47.

04-10-2003, 01:00	#22
VRS_Barry Briskodian Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Glasgow Posts: 100 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Anyway torque and bhp are nothing unless they are produced effectively and at the right time. Alot of remaps available for the 1.8t engines have a boost spike in the map which gives you that pin you back in the seat surge of power feeling but does little to help the overall performance of the car. What you want is a smooth curve to a high torque figure which should be held for as long as possible throughout the rev range. High HP is nice too for top end!! __________________ Misano Red MTM Audi RS4 Star Performance Custom Tuning 548bhp 664Nm, Sports Manifolds, Milltek + 100 Cell Race Cats, Movit Brakes, 19" Bi-Motos, H&R PSC Coilover Kit Silver Fabia VRS Hybrid Turbo Conversion, Milltek Exhaust and Cat, BMC Carbon Air Box, FMIC, Seat Sport Strut Brace, Brembos, KW Coilovers, Mille Miglia MM-S 17's, Custom Leather, Sat Nav Red Fabia 1.4TDI Estate Star Performance DPT Tuned 107bhp/170lbft, VRS Wheels, Eibach Springs

04-10-2003, 10:25	#23
devonutopia Mongreller Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Exeter / Devon Posts: 30,070 Images: 5 Thanks: 76 Thanked 346 Times in 289 Posts	Barry - You don't know a guy called Steve Murray, a director of a blinds company from Livingston? - I'm aware he now runs around in an RS6 too, after progressing from a Nissan Skyline. (He's a customer of my Dad's company) __________________ Jason - Mongrel owner! WOOOOF! Grrrrr Custom Fabia Bonnet Lifter Kits - £45! Click Me. Cheesy bonnet lifter video to "raise me up" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMnGECEi5Oc See the mongrel's 260bhp Dyno Video!

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Torque Or Bhp?

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