Octavia vRS - Standard Vs Revo Trial - Comparison

Ninj · 14-07-2005, 09:08

I thought Id move this over here as I found the results pretty interesting. The subject was an 03 Octy vRS which was otherwise stock.
Standard figures were:180.1 Hp @ 5840 RPM & 187 ft/lb @ 2320 RPM
Revo Trial figures were: 187.2 Hp @ 4720 RPM & 231.4 ft/lb @ 3560 RPM

I was suprised that there was just a 7 BHP increase but even more suprised at the 44 ft/lb of torque! The car drove way better and you can see from the Block 115 (boost) graph the increase in boost.

Couple of questions, what are the safe limits for boost before overboost protection comes in, I dont want to be that near to them because these tests were done on a fairly warm day and come the cold weather itll be overboosting all the time.

Also, does anyone have any thoughts on the A/F Ratio graph? It seems fairly safe to me but I dont know the specifics of the Skoda engine.

Thanks for any advice, the following graphs were taken with VAG-COM.

Block 120 Torque/BHP:

Block 115 - Boost:

Block 002 - A/F Ratio

I was very impressed by the Revo trial, like I say I was expecting nearer the 207 Bhp Revo quote on the website but the car was vastly more responsive and quicker in every gear.
Thanks for any advice, all comments welcomed

Rgds Rich

WW_VRS · 14-07-2005, 09:35

Just proves that the torque makes it a lot more driveable

The bhp doesnt go up all that much as the max torque at higher revs is fairly similar, and the bhp is revs * torque (divided/multiplied by some other junk but hey

)

Should be a lot easier on motorway cruising, less need to change gears if you're not in need for max performance

I seem to remember that the 'real' Revo is slightly more tuned than the trial version, but it's worth confirming it with them

You gonna get it REVOd then, after having driven with the trial ?

Andy vRS · 14-07-2005, 09:36

Intereting stuff. I am supprised by how messy it looks. I expected it to be very smooth. It sounds like you have a lot of torque, not sure why you wouldn't have more power though...........

If it drives perfect, i can't see it causing a problem though.

As you can see, custom code is A LOT smoother, but a remapped Octy will gain more torque than power:

Ninj · 14-07-2005, 09:45

Bear in mind, this is a VAG-COM power curve so it will always be more spikey than a Rolling Road curve.

I also heard that the proper Revo software is more aggresive than than the trial, Id still be suprised if it made 20BHP more than the trial to bring it line with the quotes on the website, but hey, I was suitably impressed and JBS and Jabba are just oo much of a drive, warranty issues withstanding.

Does anyone have any input on the boost/AFR curves?

Also, Block 002, what sort of Air Mass should I be expecting, its pulling 151.7 g/s @ 6280 RPM standard and 159.7 g/s @ 5680 RPM Revo.

Rgds

Rich

Mil · 14-07-2005, 10:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy vRS

It sounds like you have a lot of torque, not sure why you wouldn't have more power though...........

Because increasing torque does not always mean increasing power...in fact, sometimes, by increasing torque you make a sacrifice for less power.

Ninj · 14-07-2005, 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by WW_VRS

You gonna get it REVOd then, after having driven with the trial ?

Yeh, without a doubt. Im away for the next few weeks unfortunately but Im just toying with two options:
a) Go for the 3 Bar map
b) Fit a 4 Bar FPR and go straight for the 4 Bar map

Rgds

Rich

rich1068 · 14-07-2005, 11:22

4 bar.

Ninj · 14-07-2005, 11:24

I've heard Kev say that the 4 bar software is an older line now and the regular map offers similar gains. Surely though, you must be better off with a 4 bar FPR even with the regular map?

Thanks

Rich

rich1068 · 14-07-2005, 11:32

TBH I'm a bit out of touch with the next generation Revo products. When I had mine the choice was straightforward 3 or 4 bar plus whatever SPS you fancied.

Ninj · 14-07-2005, 11:33

Im sure someone from Revo will be along soon to comment.

Custom Code at JBS is just too much of a journey unfortunately

Rgds

Rich

RevoKev · 14-07-2005, 17:16

Hey mate, bear in mind the calculations VAG COM uses to get to the BHP go out the window once software is installed.. thus you don't really get acurate figures from it.
Full software is slightly better all round, plus the added switchability allows you to alter certain parameters.
In regards to options, we don't do 4bar only specific software anymore.. regular software will give you similar driving results to the old software now.. new tricks can be learn't everyday! The stage 2 software that requires a 4bar FPR is also built for cars with uprated DP's, Exhausts, intakes. So is even more 'aggressive'

Hope this helps!

Ninj · 14-07-2005, 17:47

Hi Kev, thanks for the reply.

So can I assume that there would be no point in running a 4 bar FPR unless I have effectively stage 2 mods?

As far as VAG-COM goes, I thought that seeing as block 120 was measuring ASR Torque and the figures from the spreadsheet are just a calculation of this, it should still provide equally as accurate figures to standard. The block 002 MAF and 115 Boost should also read accurately because they are just measuring the amount of air the MAF is flowing and boost vs ambient.

Any idea if 159.7 g/s is good MAF flow?

Thanks again

Rgds

Rich

primey · 15-07-2005, 13:10

How much is the upgrade to Stage 2 software if you are already running a 4 bar old program?

**VRStu** · 15-07-2005, 14:02

From what I have been reading about using VAG-COM to measure power it seems that measurments on mapped cars are unrelaible as stated by Kev.

Ninj · 17-07-2005, 09:22

Yeh, I've heard it said but nobody seems to be able to say why. Which blocks are affected?

Furthermore, it seems strange that Revo should recommend VAG-COMs use in their SPS3 Tuning Guide for Revod cars, if its so inaccurate.

RevoKev · 01-08-2005, 14:16

It's not inaccurate at monitoring engine sensors, but the calculation is based on airflow and doesn't take into account the likes of more advanced timing.

Upgrade to Stg2 would only cost the difference.. ie: £50 + vat!

14-07-2005, 09:08	#1
Ninj Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 83 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Octavia vRS - Standard Vs Revo Trial - Comparison I thought Id move this over here as I found the results pretty interesting. The subject was an 03 Octy vRS which was otherwise stock. Standard figures were:180.1 Hp @ 5840 RPM & 187 ft/lb @ 2320 RPM Revo Trial figures were: 187.2 Hp @ 4720 RPM & 231.4 ft/lb @ 3560 RPM I was suprised that there was just a 7 BHP increase but even more suprised at the 44 ft/lb of torque! The car drove way better and you can see from the Block 115 (boost) graph the increase in boost. Couple of questions, what are the safe limits for boost before overboost protection comes in, I dont want to be that near to them because these tests were done on a fairly warm day and come the cold weather itll be overboosting all the time. Also, does anyone have any thoughts on the A/F Ratio graph? It seems fairly safe to me but I dont know the specifics of the Skoda engine. Thanks for any advice, the following graphs were taken with VAG-COM. Block 120 Torque/BHP: Block 115 - Boost: Block 002 - A/F Ratio I was very impressed by the Revo trial, like I say I was expecting nearer the 207 Bhp Revo quote on the website but the car was vastly more responsive and quicker in every gear. Thanks for any advice, all comments welcomed Rgds Rich Last edited by Ninj; 14-07-2005 at 11:17.

14-07-2005, 09:35	#2
WW_VRS Escorted Estate Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Oxfordshire/Berkshire Posts: 9,853 Thanks: 45 Thanked 81 Times in 71 Posts	Just proves that the torque makes it a lot more driveable The bhp doesnt go up all that much as the max torque at higher revs is fairly similar, and the bhp is revs * torque (divided/multiplied by some other junk but hey ) Should be a lot easier on motorway cruising, less need to change gears if you're not in need for max performance I seem to remember that the 'real' Revo is slightly more tuned than the trial version, but it's worth confirming it with them You gonna get it REVOd then, after having driven with the trial ? __________________ WW --->> Project Journal (pic links in first post there) Lummox'/Ross thread on Unit18 Automotive progress on my car: here

14-07-2005, 09:45	#4
Ninj Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 83 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Bear in mind, this is a VAG-COM power curve so it will always be more spikey than a Rolling Road curve. I also heard that the proper Revo software is more aggresive than than the trial, Id still be suprised if it made 20BHP more than the trial to bring it line with the quotes on the website, but hey, I was suitably impressed and JBS and Jabba are just oo much of a drive, warranty issues withstanding. Does anyone have any input on the boost/AFR curves? Also, Block 002, what sort of Air Mass should I be expecting, its pulling 151.7 g/s @ 6280 RPM standard and 159.7 g/s @ 5680 RPM Revo. Rgds Rich Last edited by Ninj; 14-07-2005 at 10:28.

14-07-2005, 11:22	#7
rich1068 Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: North Posts: 2,709 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	4 bar. __________________ Rich. Skoda Octavia RS

14-07-2005, 11:24	#8
Ninj Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 83 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I've heard Kev say that the 4 bar software is an older line now and the regular map offers similar gains. Surely though, you must be better off with a 4 bar FPR even with the regular map? Thanks Rich Last edited by Ninj; 14-07-2005 at 11:26.

14-07-2005, 11:32	#9
rich1068 Briskodian Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: North Posts: 2,709 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	TBH I'm a bit out of touch with the next generation Revo products. When I had mine the choice was straightforward 3 or 4 bar plus whatever SPS you fancied. __________________ Rich. Skoda Octavia RS Last edited by rich1068; 14-07-2005 at 11:32. Reason: Mentioning other tuners in Revo's section. Sorry.

14-07-2005, 11:33	#10
Ninj Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 83 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Im sure someone from Revo will be along soon to comment. Custom Code at JBS is just too much of a journey unfortunately Rgds Rich Last edited by Ninj; 14-07-2005 at 12:08.

14-07-2005, 17:16	#11
RevoKev Site Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 214 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 13 Posts	Hey mate, bear in mind the calculations VAG COM uses to get to the BHP go out the window once software is installed.. thus you don't really get acurate figures from it. Full software is slightly better all round, plus the added switchability allows you to alter certain parameters. In regards to options, we don't do 4bar only specific software anymore.. regular software will give you similar driving results to the old software now.. new tricks can be learn't everyday! The stage 2 software that requires a 4bar FPR is also built for cars with uprated DP's, Exhausts, intakes. So is even more 'aggressive' Hope this helps!

14-07-2005, 17:47	#12
Ninj Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 83 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Hi Kev, thanks for the reply. So can I assume that there would be no point in running a 4 bar FPR unless I have effectively stage 2 mods? As far as VAG-COM goes, I thought that seeing as block 120 was measuring ASR Torque and the figures from the spreadsheet are just a calculation of this, it should still provide equally as accurate figures to standard. The block 002 MAF and 115 Boost should also read accurately because they are just measuring the amount of air the MAF is flowing and boost vs ambient. Any idea if 159.7 g/s is good MAF flow? Thanks again Rgds Rich Last edited by Ninj; 14-07-2005 at 18:03. Reason: cos I cant spell ;)

15-07-2005, 13:10	#13
primey Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: South Yorkshire Posts: 850 Thanks: 4 Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts	How much is the upgrade to Stage 2 software if you are already running a 4 bar old program? __________________ Paul My Car - Nightfire Blue Superb - 2.5 V6 TDi - Dark Leather Interior - Xenons - Serious Pimp Tints - Sat Nav - Detchable Towbar - Green Cotton Panel Filter - MINTEX Xtreme Performance Brake Pads - Chrome Wing Mirrors - 18" New RS4 Rims - Neuspeed Lower Rear ARB - Pipewerx Custom Stainless Exhaust with 200cel Cat - Custom Code PHASE II Remap - Huge Smile - Can my bank account keep up? ...

15-07-2005, 14:02	#14
VRStu Briskoda Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hampshire Posts: 20,728 Thanks: 139 Thanked 983 Times in 880 Posts	From what I have been reading about using VAG-COM to measure power it seems that measurments on mapped cars are unrelaible as stated by Kev. __________________ Stu Stu's Websites - http://www.fabia-vrs.com & http://www.octavia-vrs.com Stu's Car - 2008 Audi S3 - Ibis White, Black Optics Pack, Privacy Glass, Auto Bi Xenon Headlights, Rain Sensing Wipers, Bose Sound System, Ipod Prep, GSM Phone Prep, Flat Bottom Multi Function Steering Wheel, Electric Folding Mirrors, Acoustic Parking, Cruise Control, Interior Light Pack, Non Smokers Pack. SWMBO's Car - 2008 Seat LEON TDi Stylance, Black Magic, Sports Pack, Rear Parking Sensors. Something for Weekend - A Patio

17-07-2005, 09:22	#15
Ninj Briskodian Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 83 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Yeh, I've heard it said but nobody seems to be able to say why. Which blocks are affected? Furthermore, it seems strange that Revo should recommend VAG-COMs use in their SPS3 Tuning Guide for Revod cars, if its so inaccurate. Last edited by Ninj; 17-07-2005 at 09:25.

01-08-2005, 14:16	#16
RevoKev Site Sponsor Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 214 Thanks: 0 Thanked 15 Times in 13 Posts	It's not inaccurate at monitoring engine sensors, but the calculation is based on airflow and doesn't take into account the likes of more advanced timing. Upgrade to Stg2 would only cost the difference.. ie: £50 + vat!

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Octavia vRS - Standard Vs Revo Trial - Comparison

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