Custom Remap Figures (A bit disappointed)

[rowly_747]

Hello, I have a 05 octy mk1 VRS, and went to get a custom remap from PD Tuning in North East, on saturday which left me rather disappointed with the figures although car is totally transformed.

Current mods: CAI, 007P DV, Motorsport creations TIP, 2.5" cat back exhaust system.

It made max 176 hp and 200 torque standard with 0.7 - 0.9 bar boost. After it had map on and tweaked gave me 209 hp and 252 torque at 3500 rpm ish with 1.4 - 1.5 bar boost. Only started using 99 ron sat morning!

It was 28 degrees in workshop that day i must add. He said it could easily give me more power but is limited to the SMIC. Inlet temperatures were getting to 60 degrees 30 over ambient, which isn't good. On the dyno graph there is a big blip in the curve which then recovers. The guys answer was that the ignition timing was cut back because the inlet temps were getting too high, and he couldn't do anything to resolve this issue, but did add that this wouldn't happen on the road.

Why I posted this is because i've read that you can get 210 bhp with generic stage 1 remap at 1.2 bar boost not 1.5 like mine has, is this 1.5 bar too much for this KO3s turbo? I'm wondering what I can do to decrease the temps. The guy suggested the TT arch mod and to get rid of the CAI as it gets too warm from engine. CAI goes right down below battery and was a nightmare to fit. Could try ripping off the near side undertray perhaps? The guy instead suggested a panel filter and de-fin the standard air box. Would this be better?

Are these good figures considering the ambient temps?

The map is some what smooth and it pulls like a train now from about 2200 to 4000 rpm. On sat nite when the weather drew in, in north east it really went for it and now still is getting better.

Will post graphs later.

Overall I am pleased but thought it would have made more. Could anyone help with this issue of cooling with the SMIC don't want to change if don't have too.

Edited 28 June, 2010 by rowly_747

[KenONeill]

Who's generic map were you reading gives 210bhp? If it's the Jabba one, you're probably past that anyway, since their wheels to flywheel correction is more optomistic than most.

The high ambiant and dry air could drop you another 4 or 5% wrt a damp late Autumn evening, so that's maybe another 8bhp.

The TT arch mod is worth doing (by Swiss cheesing the arch, "pikey" B%Q galvanised loovre cover or real Audi part.

Heat soak is always going to be worse on a dyno than on the road anyway.

[shark_90]

We have previously had 251bhp from a 1.8T AUQ with an intake an exhaust (standard SMIC).

More is definitely possible.

[rowly_747]

We have previously had 251bhp from a 1.8T AUQ with an intake an exhaust (standard SMIC).

More is definitely possible.

How do you acheive this tho? Forge intercooler silicone hoses and neuspeed pancake pipe? Is 1.5 bar about right or too much?

[rowly_747]

Who's generic map were you reading gives 210bhp? If it's the Jabba one, you're probably past that anyway, since their wheels to flywheel correction is more optomistic than most.

The high ambiant and dry air could drop you another 4 or 5% wrt a damp late Autumn evening, so that's maybe another 8bhp.

The TT arch mod is worth doing (by Swiss cheesing the arch, "pikey" B%Q galvanised loovre cover or real Audi part.

Heat soak is always going to be worse on a dyno than on the road anyway.

I was talking to a VRS owner who got a remap at cheshire auto tune, apparently he is now running 225bhp with 240 ftlbs @ 1.5 bar boost. Only mods are blueflame cat back and uprated forge look alike dv. The guy mapped out the n249 valve. Is this a good idea with a remap heard not to do it with one but can do it without one?

[vRSy]

iirc PD tuning has a dyno dynamics rollers, so what your seeing is probably alright, dont forget how hot it is at the moment, and how inefficient the side mount intercooler is.

most rolling roads read higher than DD rollers

[KenONeill]

iirc PD tuning has a dyno dynamics rollers, so what your seeing is probably alright, dont forget how hot it is at the moment, and how inefficient the side mount intercooler is.

most rolling roads read higher than DD rollers

This is a practical illustration of my point in #2 Para1.

[SideshowBob]

Not sure if this is any use to you, but my p-torque stage 1 map made 211bhp and 230lb-ft running 18psi peak and settling at 15psi.

You've got a decent wedge of torque there, any chance you can post your dyno graph up?

At the end of the day forget the figures it's how it drives that counts. Give me a smooth driveable map any day over a peaky one that looks good on paper but doesn't do the car any good. As others have said, you are seeing the limitations of the SMIC amongst other things so at this point you either have to accept those limitations or decide to go FMIC instead.

I had the lid off the airbox last weekend and decided it wasn't worth the aggro of de-finning it (not unless someone can prove a reasonable increase) but I will be doing the pikey arch mod soon. My reasons for that are, if it didn't do anything then why would it be there on the 225bhp models? It must help.

[shark_90]

How do you acheive this tho? Forge intercooler silicone hoses and neuspeed pancake pipe? Is 1.5 bar about right or too much?

That car just had an exhaust with downpipe and cat, and an intake. Otherwise stock.

1.5bar is a little bit too much.

[rowly_747]

As promised my dyno graphs. It infact made over 260 torque.

[Dan lewis]

PD Tuning aka Vsport, wouldnt trust they at all. They ripped ALOT of people off previously under the name VSPORT!

[rowly_747]

Don't think i've been ripped of still happy with the performance and driveability just thought it would avhe made more. But i was talking to my mate who ahs a 2.3t aero and when he didn't ahve a downpipe the EGT was through the roof which doesn't help so may need to get one.

[richm]

don't worry too much about the figures you get from a rolling road, especially if the ambient temperature is high - unless they've got a HUGE fan, the cooling is unlikely to be enough to get realistic intercooler function.

The SMIC is marginal at best after a remap and it's not uncommon to see inlet air temps reaching 60C. Apart from the hottest days, you can just about get away with it on the road, as you're rarely able to sustain high enough load for long enough to heatsoak the IC core. Track action is a different story though, and ultimately a bigger intercooler is what's needed.

If you have access to diagnostic kit (vagcom or similar) to monitor live data values, go out and monitor/log the inlet air temperature and knock retard values, that will give you a good idea if the management system is pulling timing in response to elevated inlet air temp.

Sounds like you are quite happy with the performance on the road, that is all that matters, the rest is only pub talk

[VRS Mike]

I'm getting mine stage1 remapped on Friday at R-tech, they quote that I should get figures off around 210bhp/230lbft but also that I won't get any nasty peaks on the turbo. I'll post up graphs once its done. I don't think your figures are bad but don't know why you had a custom map?

[rowly_747]

Thanks for your comment richm.

Madmike I had a custom map because with the upgrades I have i wanted the most out of it. Stage 1 is for unmodified cars as in bought from a factory then took down for remap straight away. With an induction and turbo inlet pipe etc it was advised to get it custom mapped as there is more air flow now. I'm going to get a decat pipe soon to unleash a few more horses.

One thing i've noticed since remap tho is the cold air feed that i've bolted to where the standard air box goes has sheared off :S Do you think i need to fit my dog mount urgently, I mean during remapping on the RR the engine was rocking back and forth, but got told that is common :S Can someone shed some light please?

Oh forgot also when I got remap my ECu ID came back as been an 01 seat leon 1.8t. This was bought from a main dealer and i am the second owner. Do you think this car has been mapped before or do skoda e.g Derek Slacks use different companies codes?

Neil

Edited 5 July, 2010 by rowly_747

[VRS Mike]

surely you should have a had the exhaust fitted before the remap?

[rowly_747]

Yeh I have just not the decat. The full 2.5" cat back was fitted yeh.

[The Skud]

To give you an idea of remap vs hardware I ran a 2003 octy mk1 vrs on the same rollers, with blueflame dp/cat silicone tip, air intake and green filter along with a FMIC and got 199 bhp and 199 lbs /ft torque, post remap it was 226 bhp and 260 lbs/ft torque

running a CC tweaked ( 1.5) remap

[Wardy]

You list a Shark remap in your signature though?

Have you swapped?

[The Skud]

Torque is about right, I would say that it was suffering heat soak from the small standard SMIC, a front mount would sort that, the standard I/C does not get enough air to it even with the biggest RR Fan, with regard to the air intake, your tuner is correct re the CAI, de-fin the standard box and put a LIGHTLY oiled green cotton airfilter ( important as they come quite heavily oiled, wash it and re-oil) it was proven by a guy on UK-mkIVS doing back to back tests with Vag Com that the airbox flowed better than a CAI

[rowly_747]

yeh i was having problems spoke to ben who put his software on it and by god what a difference. Now running about 215 and about 235 torque but much more driveable now even after a few full boost runs. Since bens map have took the cai off and what an improvement again with standard filter need new panel filter like you mentioned. But for now happy with it.

[Clarkyzs]

PD Tuning aka Vsport, wouldnt trust they at all. They ripped ALOT of people off previously under the name VSPORT!

i thought PD tuning were revo dealers? eclispe perfomance use v sport i believe. spent weeks trying to get the 5hr trial from PD but they always had an excuse as to why i couldnt be fitted in.

[rowly_747]

Don´t get trial software when it says REVERTS back to normal after 12 hours of so all it does is pull back the boost leaving you with the ignition timing etc as is on the actual stage 1 remap from the revo trial so not a good idea really.

[Clarkyzs]

Don´t get trial software when it says REVERTS back to normal after 12 hours of so all it does is pull back the boost leaving you with the ignition timing etc as is on the actual stage 1 remap from the revo trial so not a good idea really.

if thats true could u not get the free trial then fit an manual boost controller and have it set to stage 1 levels?

[rowly_747]

Oh don't know but thinking about it can't see why not, only thing you would need to know is what peak boost the revo stage 1 map uses i.e peak at 1.3 1.4 then you can set it on the mbc