1.6 cr 105 bulletin

[shyfly]

went to the dealers today to find out if they had some info yet on why my scout is lacking power pulling in the 1000-1500 rpm range and also giving abysmal economy,avarages no more than 42 mpg with over 10000 miles on the clock, and was told that a bulletin had come through but they had not read it yet, so i was wandering if anyone knew anything about it or had their car updated and if so was it better worse or no different thanks

[seboni121]

went to the dealers today to find out if they had some info yet on why my scout is lacking power pulling in the 1000-1500 rpm range and also giving abysmal economy,avarages no more than 42 mpg with over 10000 miles on the clock, and was told that a bulletin had come through but they had not read it yet, so i was wandering if anyone knew anything about it or had their car updated and if so was it better worse or no different thanks

Hi sad to hear that your only getting 42mpg,I have the hatch with your engine and I easy get 60mpg with 1000 miles on the clock with winter fuel

[sharkrider]

deffo something wrong, I would insist they fix it. I can get more than that out of the vRS!

[Guest]

Hi Shyfly, sorry to hear you are not doing so well on fuel. Your comment about lack of power in the '1000rpm to 1500rpm' range does however makes me wonder a little as to why you would be driving it at those sort of revs and expect it to be powerful or 'have power'. It will also not give very good fuel economy at those revs. The 1.6cr engine is not designed to 'lug' with great power output at low revs like the 'PD' engines. Although technically a long stroke engine (but it's virtually square) it has a shorter stroke engine design to reduce piston speed and help clean up emissions. It also helps offset Euro 5's stifling regs that kill fuel economy. It seems to work too with most being happy. However, from my own experience of driving this engine and that of others who I know that have them (all very happy with the engine) it seems this engine doesn't like low revs as this increases fuel consumption and running higher revs actually reduces it. Ignore the gearchange lights on the dash, they encourage engaging the next gear too early, and this hits the fuel consumption. It is quite possible you have a problem with the car that is causing the poor consumption, but from my experience and from that of many others it seems driving technique is hugely important in getting the best out of this engine. Maybe, if you haven't already tried a differing driving style, this could help or cure the problem. Not trying to teach you to suck eggs but the 1.6cr has fooled many into thinking it's an old style diesel that will happily lug all day, and give good fuel consumption...it won't! Good luck, let us all know if the garage find any thing out about your car.

Edited 22 March, 2011 by Estate Man

[seboni121]

Hi Shyfly, sorry to hear you are not doing so well on fuel. Your comment about lack of power in the '1000rpm to 1500rpm' range does however makes me wonder a little as to why you would be driving it at those sort of revs and expect it to be powerful or 'have power'. It will also not give very good fuel economy at those revs. The 1.6cr engine is not designed to 'lug' with great power output at low revs like the 'PD' engines. Although technically a long stroke engine (but it's virtually square) it has a shorter stroke engine design to reduce piston speed and help clean up emissions. It also helps offset Euro 5's stifling regs that kill fuel economy. It seems to work too with most being happy. However, from my own experience of driving this engine and that of others who I know that have them (all very happy with the engine) it seems this engine doesn't like low revs as this increases fuel consumption and running higher revs actually reduces it. Ignore the gearchange lights on the dash, they encourage engaging the next gear too early, and this hits the fuel consumption. It is quite possible you have a problem with the car that is causing the poor consumption, but from my experience and from that of many others it seems driving technique is hugely important in getting the best out of this engine. Maybe, if you haven't already tried a differing driving style, this could help or cure the problem. Not trying to teach you to suck eggs but the 1.6cr has fooled many into thinking it's an old style diesel that will happily lug all day, and give good fuel consumption...it won't! Good luck, let us all know if the garage find any thing out about your car.

Estateman you are good!,great practical advise I rarely take the cr into 5th gear only when I reach motorway speeds and beyond

[Guest]

Estateman you are good!,great practical advise I rarely take the cr into 5th gear only when I reach motorway speeds and beyond

Hi Seb...yeah...and I note you are getting superb fuel economy. Like you I found that driving in 5th gear as directed by the dash lights caused an increase in the consumption of fuel. Leaving it in fourth gear until at least 60mph made a huge improvement in the economy. I noted this in my colleagues 90ps 1.6cr to begin with but found the same on the 105ps engine too. Nice engines though and loads of power when you need it. Can't wait to order mine.

[pipsyp]

I agree you really have to change your driving style to get the most out of the CR cars, with their poor low rev go and stratospheric gear ratios. I very rarely use 6th in my car unless i'm travelling over 60mph, 5th is actually fine at motorway speeds too!

[threadbear]

Sorry to hear about Shyflys abysmal economy. I went to visit a mate last night, who lives about 12 miles down the coast and admittedly the roads were really quiet, but driving at the legal limits which most of the time was 40 with the occassional stretch of 60, I achieved 78 mpg!!! Which frankly I was flabbergasted with!! Even when I speed up to 60, the fuel cnsumption didnt drop dramactically.

Stayed in 4th gear except in the 60mph stretches. It has taken nearly 6000 miles to be able to attain these figures. So the brochure figures are possible but only under certain circumstances.

[shyfly]

Hi Shyfly, sorry to hear you are not doing so well on fuel. Your comment about lack of power in the '1000rpm to 1500rpm' range does however makes me wonder a little as to why you would be driving it at those sort of revs and expect it to be powerful or 'have power'. It will also not give very good fuel economy at those revs. The 1.6cr engine is not designed to 'lug' with great power output at low revs like the 'PD' engines. Although technically a long stroke engine (but it's virtually square) it has a shorter stroke engine design to reduce piston speed and help clean up emissions. It also helps offset Euro 5's stifling regs that kill fuel economy. It seems to work too with most being happy. However, from my own experience of driving this engine and that of others who I know that have them (all very happy with the engine) it seems this engine doesn't like low revs as this increases fuel consumption and running higher revs actually reduces it. Ignore the gearchange lights on the dash, they encourage engaging the next gear too early, and this hits the fuel consumption. It is quite possible you have a problem with the car that is causing the poor consumption, but from my experience and from that of many others it seems driving technique is hugely important in getting the best out of this engine. Maybe, if you haven't already tried a differing driving style, this could help or cure the problem. Not trying to teach you to suck eggs but the 1.6cr has fooled many into thinking it's an old style diesel that will happily lug all day, and give good fuel consumption...it won't! Good luck, let us all know if the garage find any thing out about your car.

thank for your comments very useful,i have tried different driving styles,the reason i cited lack of power in the 1000-1500rangeis that my fiancee has the same engine in her hatch and that pulls with ease in these range,with good economy as did the new demo estate that i tried,so the problem is in the car not me hopefully,its getting asoftware update tomorrow that skoda have issued for this sluggishness hopefully it will be better,and when my montecarlo comes there will have been revisions in the ecu,although iv issues with this car,i have owned seat/skoda diesels for the last 10years which were fitted with every type of diesel engines of their time,so as an experienced diesel driver,i see no reason to change for a petrol,when all points to a fault with the scout

[Mike Wrightson]

My Dad's 1.6 CR Octy did this too. After a software update was applied to tackle a different issue (brake related, won't go any further on that just yet), he noticed that suddenly it was pulling much better below 2000rpm.

[raisbeck]

Its not just the CR that doesnt like lugging. The 1.4 PD Greenline is very poor around 1500 rpm.

5th is pointless below about 60 mph. The 5th gear is really only useful at motorway + speeds. Need to keep that boost on ! I guess with the 4 cylinders and CR injection the smoothness of the engine hides the fact your not in a good economy/performance region. Try doing that in a PD in 5th gear at 1500rpm.....it complains, a lot !

74 mpg on the trip today. Thats about 67-68 in real figures.

I may consider a GL2 in a year or so if its proven as efficient as the PD GL 1.

[Guest]

thank for your comments very useful,i have tried different driving styles,the reason i cited lack of power in the 1000-1500rangeis that my fiancee has the same engine in her hatch and that pulls with ease in these range,with good economy as did the new demo estate that i tried,so the problem is in the car not me hopefully,its getting asoftware update tomorrow that skoda have issued for this sluggishness hopefully it will be better,and when my montecarlo comes there will have been revisions in the ecu,although iv issues with this car,i have owned seat/skoda diesels for the last 10years which were fitted with every type of diesel engines of their time,so as an experienced diesel driver,i see no reason to change for a petrol,when all points to a fault with the scout

That's brilliant news Shyfly. Hopefully, as you say it will fix things. If you will, please keep posting on this one. Ta!

[R22JGB]

Estate man

I'm now convinced you must be a mole working for Skoda/Seat/VW. You know there are problems with the economy of the 1.6TDi CR engine but you are always stating everyone you know is happy with them!!!!!!!!!!!

If you read this and other VAG forums you will see there are a lot of people not happy with this engine. I'd better not say too much on here as I know the importers monitor what is being said

[seboni121]

Estate man

I'm now convinced you must be a mole working for Skoda/Seat/VW. You know there are problems with the economy of the 1.6TDi CR engine but you are always stating everyone you know is happy with them!!!!!!!!!!!

If you read this and other VAG forums you will see there are a lot of people not happy with this engine. I'd better not say too much on here as I know the importers monitor what is being said

A mole?:wonder:Estateman surely not ,I have the crtdi 1.6 with 1k on the clock ,I get 60mpg allready its a 60 plate 105bhp,as I said before I dont drive like a co**,so always get good figures the pd and cr needs to be driven a little different , the cr is a little longer geared so leave it in the gears longer before changing up.so not everyone is unhappy with there little cr furbys

[pipsyp]

My Golf 2.0 TDi CR 140 rarely betters 44mpg, on occasion I may see early 50's. Last night driving home, mild evening so completely turned the heating off (so no heat, fan or AC...havent had the AC on for a while anyway), drove home quite steadily with the occasional bit of stick and just as I was pulling up to the last roundabout before my home (approx 200 yards after a 10 mile journey from cold) car achived nearly 58 mpg! I have seen 60.1 once before but this 58 was so easily achieved. I think the use of the heater even without AC must make a huge difference to max economy!

[Guest]

Estate man

I'm now convinced you must be a mole working for Skoda/Seat/VW. You know there are problems with the economy of the 1.6TDi CR engine but you are always stating everyone you know is happy with them!!!!!!!!!!!

If you read this and other VAG forums you will see there are a lot of people not happy with this engine. I'd better not say too much on here as I know the importers monitor what is being said

Hi TSIDSG, not a mole...but an ex-tech, and I have never worked for Skoda. I have a particular interest in this subject for many reasons. I have been doing considerable research into this subject over the last 6 months. What I know is that some people are reporting a consumption problem but the actual numbers are nothing like the numbers most people seem to think, based upon what they read on forums. In fact after initially contacting some (6 individuals) on this site and the VW site who complained about a fuel consumption problem, all except one has told me the car is now (after all the initial understandable emotion and drama) performing brilliantly now that it has some decent mileage on it. That part of my research has not been exhaustive obviously, just indicative. I can honestly say I have yet to meet anyone who has this poor fuel consumption problem. My dealer too has never come across the problem and I know them and especially the techs very well. Non of them has had this problem reported, but they have seen an advisory about it. All normal stuff, we used to get them at all the dealerships I've worked at over the last 30 years. And I know a lot of people personally who have the CR1.6, all versions. I also know company bosses who use the Fabia Estate with the 1.6cr engines in as fleet cars. Again, non of them are able to find any problems with it., and if there were a fuel consumption problem the company car owners would create like hell. My sister bought the cr1.6 Estate two weeks ago (105bhp) and is driving it normally and getting 58mpg out of it straight away. That's actually better than her 1.9TDI Octavia Estate that she part ex'ed.

But what is clear is that 'some' individuals are in 'some' cases appearing to be getting less miles per gallon than they expected. From experience I know a very very small percentage of these cars may have a minor problem. Again, from experience, I know that others won't have a problem and it's down to how the car is being used/driven. And those are just facts. If you look on all the forums you will notice the same fuel consumption discussions about many of the latest Euro 5 cars no matter what make, but it sparodic just like on our site and mostly limited to brand new car owners with cars that won't give good fuel economy anyway until bedded in. If you take the forums seriously (and on stuff like this take it with a pinch of salt...believe me people love to moan) you would actually think the end of the world was happening and that Skoda were mass murderers, but if you follow up these problems that are initially reported at dealer level (it was part of my job to do that as a tech), you nearly always find the car is fine and the driver is unwittingly reporting a characteristic of the car in it's early days. It's just an actual fact that 98% of reported problems like this are not problems and everything sorts ITSELF out. But as I said...not in every case and sometimes a software update will be applied where appropriate or some other problem may be found. They are always fixed in my experience. I worked for Honda amongst others, for many years and just like any other Franchise we had the same issues constantly reported over the years. We rarely ever found a fault with the cars and the poor fuel consumption quickly sorted itself as the car/s bedded in, and these were not Euro 5 either! In many cases I proved it was the way the car was being driven and after a quick bit of advice, the owners were happy with the fuel economy. In Shyfly's case it does seem as if he may have a problem here. It will be sorted it seems. There is an advisory on this but this is no different to what constantly happens with all manufacturers and has been so for as long as I remember.

I love a good moan like everyone else but you have to look at the facts. Thats what I've had to do all my life as an engineer and tech. There are no conspiracies by manufacturers to make there cars look better than others by inflating the mpg figures either as is frequently suggested even on here. A few individuals complaining on various forums, and it's not many actually even on here if you count them, doesn't mean there is an en-mass problem. That's already been proved not to be the case. Just look at the facts.

PS. I'm not dissing anyone who actually believes they have a fuel consumption problem. Just saying stick with it, it almost certainly won't be a problem for most as it will sort itself out, or the dealer will do it for you.

To OP: Hope this doesn't go too far off the beaten track SHYFLY, but I thought it worth saying this stuff. Good luck and keep posting about your car please.

[Guest]

I'd better not say too much on here as I know the importers monitor what is being said

I think that's a reason to say what you believe TSIDSG. I do!

[shyfly]

Hi TSIDSG, not a mole...but an ex-tech, and I have never worked for Skoda. I have a particular interest in this subject for many reasons. I have been doing considerable research into this subject over the last 6 months. What I know is that some people are reporting a consumption problem but the actual numbers are nothing like the numbers most people seem to think, based upon what they read on forums. In fact after initially contacting some (6 individuals) on this site and the VW site who complained about a fuel consumption problem, all except one has told me the car is now (after all the initial understandable emotion and drama) performing brilliantly now that it has some decent mileage on it. That part of my research has not been exhaustive obviously, just indicative. I can honestly say I have yet to meet anyone who has this poor fuel consumption problem. My dealer too has never come across the problem and I know them and especially the techs very well. Non of them has had this problem reported, but they have seen an advisory about it. All normal stuff, we used to get them at all the dealerships I've worked at over the last 30 years. And I know a lot of people personally who have the CR1.6, all versions. I also know company bosses who use the Fabia Estate with the 1.6cr engines in as fleet cars. Again, non of them are able to find any problems with it., and if there were a fuel consumption problem the company car owners would create like hell. My sister bought the cr1.6 Estate two weeks ago (105bhp) and is driving it normally and getting 58mpg out of it straight away. That's actually better than her 1.9TDI Octavia Estate that she part ex'ed.

But what is clear is that 'some' individuals are in 'some' cases appearing to be getting less miles per gallon than they expected. From experience I know a very very small percentage of these cars may have a minor problem. Again, from experience, I know that others won't have a problem and it's down to how the car is being used/driven. And those are just facts. If you look on all the forums you will notice the same fuel consumption discussions about many of the latest Euro 5 cars no matter what make, but it sparodic just like on our site and mostly limited to brand new car owners with cars that won't give good fuel economy anyway until bedded in. If you take the forums seriously (and on stuff like this take it with a pinch of salt...believe me people love to moan) you would actually think the end of the world was happening and that Skoda were mass murderers, but if you follow up these problems that are initially reported at dealer level (it was part of my job to do that as a tech), you nearly always find the car is fine and the driver is unwittingly reporting a characteristic of the car in it's early days. It's just an actual fact that 98% of reported problems like this are not problems and everything sorts ITSELF out. But as I said...not in every case and sometimes a software update will be applied where appropriate or some other problem may be found. They are always fixed in my experience. I worked for Honda amongst others, for many years and just like any other Franchise we had the same issues constantly reported over the years. We rarely ever found a fault with the cars and the poor fuel consumption quickly sorted itself as the car/s bedded in, and these were not Euro 5 either! In many cases I proved it was the way the car was being driven and after a quick bit of advice, the owners were happy with the fuel economy. In Shyfly's case it does seem as if he may have a problem here. It will be sorted it seems. There is an advisory on this but this is no different to what constantly happens with all manufacturers and has been so for as long as I remember.

I love a good moan like everyone else but you have to look at the facts. Thats what I've had to do all my life as an engineer and tech. There are no conspiracies by manufacturers to make there cars look better than others by inflating the mpg figures either as is frequently suggested even on here. A few individuals complaining on various forums, and it's not many actually even on here if you count them, doesn't mean there is an en-mass problem. That's already been proved not to be the case. Just look at the facts.

PS. I'm not dissing anyone who actually believes they have a fuel consumption problem. Just saying stick with it, it almost certainly won't be a problem for most as it will sort itself out, or the dealer will do it for you.

To OP: Hope this doesn't go too far off the beaten track SHYFLY, but I thought it worth saying this stuff. Good luck and keep posting about your car please.

no it doesnt,that is a well written knowlegable reply,i should get my scout back tomorrow,it also may need a new trottle pedal,as its does not always respond to movement and is stiffer than other fabias iv tried,il post up any resultswhen iv tried it for a couple of days,thanks

Edited 23 March, 2011 by shyfly

[seboni121]

WELL today did round trip of about 60 miles,64mpg at roughly 60-65mph took her up to 110 and at 3.500 rpm bloody hell she's quick ,and I was getting 56.6mpg at this speed but at the 1.500rpm it does labour but only if you are in a to higher gear changing down cures this,a alfa romeo 2.0jtd nor a vauxhall sporty thing could not keep up,once you are in 5th the speed climbs so quickly and seems effortless

[Guest]

Hi again shyfly, do make sure to follow up on the throttle issue. Faulty fly by wire throttles can affect fuel economy too. Again...good luck!

[Guest]

WELL today did round trip of about 60 miles,64mpg at roughly 60-65mph took her up to 110 and at 3.500 rpm bloody hell she's quick ,and I was getting 56.6mpg at this speed but at the 1.500rpm it does labour but only if you are in a to higher gear changing down cures this,a alfa romeo 2.0jtd nor a vauxhall sporty thing could not keep up,once you are in 5th the speed climbs so quickly and seems effortless

Seb...I saw a shiny black fast moving object today re-entering the atmosphere...I realise now it was you!

[seboni121]

Seb...I saw a shiny black fast moving object today re-entering the atmosphere...I realise now it was you!

My moto's always been" TO INFINITY AND BEYOND!!!!!!!!!",I am putting some beans into it not because I want to !, its because she's telling me too! christine all over again ,on a serious note though "don't try this at home kids!",or the rozzers will have you ,only if they can catch you ".going to change my name to "SMOKEY" and the wifey to the"BANDIT"!:love:

[shyfly]

Hi again shyfly, do make sure to follow up on the throttle issue. Faulty fly by wire throttles can affect fuel economy too. Again...good luck!

got the car back yesterday,did 103miles today over various roads and traffic,after filling up untill the pump clicked twice, the maxidot showed about 47 average,then i refilled in the same manner,it took 8.3 litres to do 103 miles,which at 4.5 liters to a gallon,meant id used 1.8gallons, which equates to 57 mpg,this shows the maxidot to be inacurrate,but also there seems to be some improvements in whats been done,in either the upgrade or freeing off the throttle,going on a decent motorway run tomorrow,then il try again,im happier now with it,and the monte should be better as the scout is more slabsided and not as low as the montecarlo