Any Google Nest/Hive Thermostat Users?

[farty]

In  a previous house, I had Hive.  Installation was included in the cost.  It took the British Gas fitter four hours!  It worked really well.  I normally kept the thermostat in the lounge but, as it's portable, you take it where you are spending most time.  I worked at sea and it was great to monitor the house all around the world and to turn the heating on the day before we got home.  I also fitted a PIR motion detector which was wireless.  

 

In my current house I use Homematic TRVs and room stats.  All rather expensive but German engineered.  

[Lady Elanore]

Don't forget you can do Hue with Hive. This is what it looks like when you want to add a new thing to Hive. The 'Add another device' thing on the bottom left is for Hive lights and PIRs etc and it auto finds them for you

[Cubbington]

Thanks Both,

 

I contacted the installation company yesterday, and have asked for them to do a site visit, as they do a few of the systems.

 

Cheers,

 

Nick

[Lady Elanore]

If I had paid for someone to fit the system, I might have gone for NEST, but as I wanted to do it myself (a bit of a challenge keeps you young...or freezing cold if you bork the heating system of your house), HIVE was by far the easier option   

[greenstripe]

I installed Hive myself and found it pretty straightforward. I already had a (non-smart) wireless thermostat so replacing the receiver and transposing the wiring was easy enough.

Installation instructions are freely available eg here:

 

https://www.theunderfloorheatingstore.com/media/ufhs/manuals/hive-thermostat-installation-guide.pdf

[Lady Elanore]

I think the only mod I had to do was link the live to the relay's traveller. Would have to open it up to check, but it was the work of 2 minutes, if that  Nest would have been too tricky for me as I'd have to sort out the connections for the boiler controls and I don't have a schematic - and to be honest I would be quite likely to muck it up  

[cheezemonkhai]

Our stat has decided it's always 21 degrees, so considering these two and thought I might as well tag the question onto this thread.

Can somebody answer the following for me:

 

1) Does the hive require me to install the receiver where the exiting stat is and move everything around wirelessly or can I get a version that just wires up to the boiler?

2) Do I need to keep a hue bridge and a Hive bridge if I want to use the hue app, or can I just use a single one of the hive/hue bridge for both?

 

I'm not keen on google for their data slurping, but at the same time, nest seems relatively more simple as long as you can wire in (or get wired in) the receiver box correctly. (That being the question).

 

Thoughts welcome.

 

[farty]

The receiver goes where the programmer was.  The stat, often in the hallway, is redundant.  The hive hub is essential and I think you will need the Hue one too as they are not interoperable.  But I don't have Hue.  Just see what happens if you unplug the Hue hub after Hive has recognised the bulbs.

[cheezemonkhai]

13 minutes ago, farty said:

The receiver goes where the programmer was.  The stat, often in the hallway, is redundant.  The hive hub is essential and I think you will need the Hue one too as they are not interoperable.  But I don't have Hue.  Just see what happens if you unplug the Hue hub after Hive has recognised the bulbs.

Thanks.

 

No point doing that, I only have so many power points by ethernet ports, so it looks like hive is out.

It's a shame as they could easily make a smart stat that connects to wifi and had a 240v to 12v transformer in it allowing the switched live systems most UK houses have.

 

Never mind, will do a bit of digging at the other options out there as well as the programmable stats that you can programme from an app.

[Kenny R]

As above the Nest heat link replaces the old programmer, and has a 12v supply that can be used using the old stat wiring to supply 12v to the Nest thermostat. The Nest thermostat connects wirelessly to the heat link.

You also have the option of changing the location of the thermostat using the thermostat stand, which lets you plug the thermostat into any convenient 13A socket.

I chose the Nest over the hive as it one less hub required to clutter up the window sill.

[farty]

40 minutes ago, cheezemonkhai said:

Thanks.

 

No point doing that, I only have so many power points by ethernet ports, so it looks like hive is out.

It's a shame as they could easily make a smart stat that connects to wifi and had a 240v to 12v transformer in it allowing the switched live systems most UK houses have.

 

Never mind, will do a bit of digging at the other options out there as well as the programmable stats that you can programme from an app.

The receiver does not need ethernet.  And it gets its mains from where the programmer got it.  The hub connects to your router or range extender.  The thermostat is battery operated.  Can be wall mounted or free standing.

[Lady Elanore]

This below is for Hive not Nest

 

My receiver/hub lives next to my router (it's plugged into it and lives on the floor under my PC desk-I figured it would be best chance for a stronger signal in my cluttered office space) and the original thermostat is replaced with a thick cover which houses the switching relay for the 'call for heat'. It's not exactly flush to the wall but is about half the depth of the original Thermostat (I had a Drayton stylee one which looked like a robot cyclops - Or a Mr Kiplings French Fancy cakelette-if you know what I mean). With my boiler I simply leave it switched on 24/7 and the timer operation is done online with Hive or through the phone app. It avoids having to wire out the boiler timer which is a little bit more complicated than the way I did it. The actual thermostat is placed where ever I want it. I only have the heating version as my hot water is done by the combi boiler.

 

For ease of installation with my boiler Hive was super easy. Simply remove front of Therm, add a live link, plug new switching plate onto backplate (same size and fitting  ), plug in receiver/hub to router and put batteries into thermostat....done! Just a bit of online fettling to set the timers and add devices after that. If I had to do it again, now that I know what to do, it would take much longer to unpack the bits than to install the physical side of the system 

 

There is a remote Hub you can get that works with a battery back-up to keep everything working if you have a router/Interweb failure and can also alert you to things like breaking glass etc but I believe you still need the small flat receiver/hub connected to your router initially or to be able to remote access things like lights.

Edited 12 November, 2020 by Lady Elanore
Clarification

[Lady Elanore]

Btw I believe Hive can do 240V (mine) and low voltage switching which is something that many systems can't. 

[farty]

10 minutes ago, Lady Elanore said:

My receiver/hub lives next to my router (it's plugged into it)

The Hub and the receiver are separate items.  You can not plug the receiver into your router.  

 

These are receivers; a two channel for a conventional boiler with HW and CH and a single channel for combis

 

This is thr receiver which connects to your router.  It sends radio signals to the receiver.  The receiver operates the relays and stores the timer programming.

 

See the Installation Guide

 

I got British Gas to install mine and it took four hours - cost me £50!

 

[Lady Elanore]

1 hour ago, farty said:

The Hub and the receiver are separate items.  You can not plug the receiver into your router.  

 

These are receivers; a two channel for a conventional boiler with HW and CH and a single channel for combis

 

This is thr receiver which connects to your router.  It sends radio signals to the receiver.  The receiver operates the relays and stores the timer programming.

 

See the Installation Guide

 

I got British Gas to install mine and it took four hours - cost me £50!

 

 

I used the receiver/hub to reference an earlier post that said the receiver goes where the programmer was, as my programmer is built into the boiler and the receiver replaces the thermostat I previously had in the hall. I thought the post might be using different terminology to the ones that I have used in previous posts in this thread, so I modified my terminology to try and suit what I thought was intended in that post. I agree with your above description. 

 

For clarification. My receiver is a single channel that replaces the original thermostat (and it's call for heat switch) and the hub is the 'Hive router' that connects all Hive products to the web and hence your controlling devices. 

Edited 12 November, 2020 by Lady Elanore

[Lady Elanore]

£50 for 4 hours seems cheap, although 4 hours is a ridiculous length of time even if they wired out your programmer.

 

Did you make too many cups of tea for them? I know my father makes none stop tea and biscuits runs for anyone working in and around the house and doesn't seem to realise that he gets charged for the time it takes them to drink it. A week long job probably has an extra 3 or 4 hours added to it just for the excess tea! I say 'excess' as a certain amount of tea is automatically built into the builders invisible rider for the contract  

[Lady Elanore]

14 minutes ago, Lady Elanore said:

 

Oops, pressed the wrong button   I keep hitting 'Quote' as I think the edit button used to be down there? 

Edited 12 November, 2020 by Lady Elanore

[farty]

5 minutes ago, Lady Elanore said:

£50 for 4 hours seems cheap, although 4 hours is a ridiculous length of time even if they wired out your programmer.  Did you make too many cups of tea for them? 

My first wife was in the building trade.  Her tradesmen told me they were very unhappy if they were never offered a cuppa.  In my experience, most tradesmen work hard and drink their tea as they work.  I think they will do a better job if you treat them nicely.  I can't remember now but the installation was included in the deal as I was an early adopter of the Hive.  The gas fitter took endless trouble and some some problems with the wiring.  This was odd as it was a modern house on an estate with bog-standard wiring.  I paid £250 all-in.

[Lady Elanore]

The reason I put the receiver where the Thermostat had been, was because it is a simple plug and play option. If I removed the old thermostat completely I would need to get a decorator to hide the square hole on the wall. By simply plugging the receiver onto the backplate of the old thermostat you overcome this and save on the slightly fiddly wiring directly into the boilers' programmer-wiring at the boiler end. The only thing that needs to be done is a live feed needs to be added to the traveller in the receiver, so it can switch the 'call for heat' to the boiler. It also only takes a couple of minutes once you realise that it all uses the same backplate as a standard old school British Thermostat for the fitting (you are supplied with a new backplate if you wish to use that, but it only adds a couple of minutes to swap over anyway  ) 

 

British gas chap serviced my boiler (not a euphemism) a few months ago and I asked them to check everything over, he said it was fine and that he probably would have done what I did if his house was configured similarly to mine  

[farty]

2 minutes ago, Lady Elanore said:

By simply plugging the receiver onto the backplate of the old thermostat you overcome this and save on the slightly fiddly wiring directly into the boilers' progr

I think we are at cross terms.  If it fits on a standard backplate it's a programmer. Did it have timer settings?  xxx

[Lady Elanore]

No it's the receiver. It purely switches the 'live' call for heat 

[Lady Elanore]

This is similar to mine (apart from mine was the other way up). It's the backplate for the original thermostat. You can see someone has added the live link to the traveller. Can't swear that the connections are exactly the same without opening mine up again 

 

[Lady Elanore]

The receiver is nothing but a switch and as I have said, I only have a single switch requirement as I have a combi boiler so no need for preheating of water. My boiler no longer uses a timer and is left permanently on. The timer function of the programmer is taken over by Hive in the cyberspacewebthingumygig. So the switch (receiver) only has to receive a signal to tell it to turn the boiler on or off. 

 

Our systems have been fitted differently. I assume you have either an immersion tank or had a different sort of thermostat to the old school one I've mentioned 

Edited 12 November, 2020 by Lady Elanore

[Lady Elanore]

I found this on 'tinerweb. You can see roughly what my old thermostat backplate looked like, although this one is couple up to another device as you can see by the double wired connectors. You can also see the red link wire to feed a 'live' voltage to the traveller on connector'1' has been added and you can also see the call for heat on connector '3' Simply snap the receiver over the top of this backplate and it's done. No more wiring needed. 

 

 

[cheezemonkhai]

18 hours ago, farty said:

The receiver does not need ethernet.  And it gets its mains from where the programmer got it.  The hub connects to your router or range extender.  The thermostat is battery operated.  Can be wall mounted or free standing.

 

No but it needs another zigbee to ethernet bridge..

I've already got two zigbee to ethernet bridges in the house and if hive needs another one, I can't be bothered.

I'm trying to get rid of the zigbee bridges I already have not add more.

 

Currently I have the boiler on 24/7 and have a Honeywell CM907/927 that does temperature changes 6 times a day to reach a heat profile.

The only advantage of a smart thermometer for me, is to be able to easily change the programme times via an app rather than on the device itself as the seasons change.

 

Hive just adds too many components to the mix for me, as I currently have one (Wierd so no receiver) and I don't really want to go to three.

 

Does anyone know of a single package inline mains powered (not a plug),  live switching thermostat, which has wifi programmable times?

Not fussed about the fancy geolocation etc.

Edited 13 November, 2020 by cheezemonkhai