1.2 Tsi Morning Hickups (Bad idling)

[stratosg]

Hi there,

During hot summer days and with environment's temp beyond 30 degrees Centigrade my engine after ignition was revving at 700 rpm having very rough sound, instead of 1200 rpm. But unfortunately it did again three days ago with environment's temp at 17 degrees C. It sounds like the car runs with 3 out of the 4 cylinders but after 20 - 30 secs the engine runs smoothly. I contacted my local dealer and he knew nothing. I contacted then the importer and he knew nothing too, but he advised me to add an injector cleaner into my fuel tank and see what will happen. I do not intend to since this is experiment and not solution. I also asked for ECU update but no update is available for 1.2 Tsi 77kW Roomster yet.

I know there is another similar topic at the Yeti's Corner and i double post it there, but i am interested to find out what is this. I apologize for the double post, so if mods judges that this topic is improper please feel free to remove / delete it.

Regards, Stratos.

Edited 7 October, 2010 by stratosg

[xman]

Try higher octane fuel (e.g. super) - there is some evidence that the DI of the TSi does not run happily on regular fuel.

[stratosg]

I use 95 octane fuel, next choice is 100 octane fuel but it is not recommended by the manufacturer. At the fuel cap says 95 octane fuel.

By the way what is DI?

Edited 7 October, 2010 by stratosg

[rk696]

Direct injection.

[stratosg]

Direct injection.

Thank you very much. I'm not English, so...

[paully]

HI I`ve got the Fabia with the same engine as you and had very similar problems. The TSI engine can run very rough when cold and doesnt matter what the outside temperature is. The rpm of this engine is very low at just over 700 revs normally which does not help and cannot be increased like you used to be able to do :( I have found that higher grade petrol 99/100 octane and especially Shell fuel makes all the difference. Skoda say the car can run on 95 but it does not run well. Try the other fuel and see if it makes a difference

[stratosg]

Ouch!! That hurts 1.70 per liter is quite expensive solution. I believe that there should be an ECU update / upgrade in the near future. Same and even worse problems were solved with an ECU update / upgrade at polos wearing 1.2Tsi unit.

[Nake]

Ouch!! That hurts 1.70 per liter is quite expensive solution. I believe that there should be an ECU update / upgrade in the near future. Same and even worse problems were solved with an ECU update / upgrade at polos wearing 1.2Tsi unit.

I was tried with Lukoil 95 and 98 octanes petrol and there is no difference in behavior, same symptoms, same rattles, with no rules when they occur. As a curiosity, this morning my Yeti 1.2 has proper start with no rattles on 7 C temperature!!!!!!

[stratosg]

Same temperature but engine started with rattles.

And something else, i tried to push the gas pedal to the floor while car was idle (of course with well warmed engine) and i found out that the maximum rpm are 3.800. None of the previous cars i owned had that rev stopper or how it is called. My previous cars were an '96 PUG 106 1.4 XN, an 2002 Octavia 1.6 and a 2006 Fabia 1.2 12v 64hp.

Edited 11 October, 2010 by stratosg

[Uro? TSI]

Same temperature but engine started with rattles.

And something else, i tried to push the gas pedal to the floor while car was idle (of course with well warmed engine) and i found out that the maximum rpm are 3.800. None of the previous cars i owned had that rev stopper or how it is called. My previous cars were an '96 PUG 106 1.4 XN, an 2002 Octavia 1.6 and a 2006 Fabia 1.2 12v 64hp.

That is normal, many new engines have a max rpm in idle. You cannot hit the blockade of the rpm, and push it in the red zone while not moving.

[menir1]

The TSI engine is based on direct injection technology. It operates in poor fuel/air mixture, in high temperature and very high compression ratio. Therefore high octane (RON 98/99) should be use in order to get optimal running (both from performance and fuel consumption perspectives). I believe that VAG withhold recommending super fuel due to marketing reasons.

BTW, it takes about two fuel tanks for the engine controller to adapt to an upgraded fuel, so if you are going to try super please take it into consideration.

[stratosg]

I only use and i will use 95 octane petrol as mentioned at the fuel cap by the manufacturer. I will not use 100 octane petrol and there is no 98 octane Petrol in my country. If I knew that the problem is the fuel octane grades and the engine needs high octane fuel, i would never bought a Tsi engine. I bought it for economy not for paying 100 euros each time i am visiting the fuel station.

The car had her last bad idling at 5 October, since then she runs perfectly. She keeps giving me a 5.5 lt/100Km fuel consumption at 90 - 100Km speed and 6.2 to 6.7 at 120 - 130 km/h speed. In the city the consumption is from 6.7 to 12 lt/100 Km at an average of 8.

I think it is ECU mapping issue since last time (5 October) the engine wasn't too cold neither too hot but in a quite warm state having the blue warning light indicating cold state of engine (On). The car was parked for three hours after using her for city job issues, so i concluded that the engine was warm while ambient temperature was 7 degrees Centigrades.

Uroš TSI you are absolutely right my dealer told me that too, then we tried it to my friend's 1.8 Tsi Superb and behaved the same.

[stratosg]

Since my last post and after 2000 more kilometers (totally 8.123 Kms) on clock, my Roomster did not perform cold start twice last week and many times during last month. The weird is that even the revs is still at about 900, bad idling (hick-ups) just disappeared and the engine runs smoothly. I'm still using 95 octane petrol, from the same petrol station.

Any news from you would be great.

[bluecar1]

Since my last post and after 2000 more kilometers (totally 8.123 Kms) on clock, my Roomster did not perform cold start twice last week and many times during last month. The weird is that even the revs is still at about 900, bad idling (hick-ups) just disappeared and the engine runs smoothly. I'm still using 95 octane petrol, from the same petrol station.

Any news from you would be great.

did you just get a tankfull from the bottom of the filling stations tank with a load of rubbish and water? and this has now worked through

other than that only thing that springs to mind is a sticky valve / solenoid somewhere on the engine, that has now freed itself (been giving it a bit of wellie lately?)

[stratosg]

a. did you just get a tankfull from the bottom of the filling stations tank with a load of rubbish and water? and this has now worked through

b. other than that only thing that springs to mind is a sticky valve / solenoid somewhere on the engine, that has now freed itself (been giving it a bit of wellie lately?)

a.

No i do never let my tank to go down to the bottom. I always visit gas station when i consume half of the tank capacity. And as i said before i always visit the same gas station for over 10 years now. Even when i am traveling far from my hometown i always seek for a gas station of the same fuel brand. I do not mention the name since its a Greek fuel company.

b.

I really don't know. The strange thing is that the car did not perform cold start two days ago with ambient temperature at 4 oC. Revs were ~900 but the engine worked fine and smoothly. Far from erratic cold start operation, car behaves perfectly.

[menir1]

a.

No i do never let my tank to go down to the bottom. I always visit gas station when i consume half of the tank capacity. And as i said before i always visit the same gas station for over 10 years now. Even when i am traveling far from my hometown i always seek for a gas station of the same fuel brand. I do not mention the name since its a Greek fuel company.

b.

I really don't know. The strange thing is that the car did not perform cold start two days ago with ambient temperature at 4 oC. Revs were ~900 but the engine worked fine and smoothly. Far from erratic cold start operation, car behaves perfectly.

When I picked up my Roomster from the dealer, it had 1/3 tank full with 95 Octane. I've experienced the same 'choking' in idle, or when braking. On my first refull, I've filled it up with 98 Octane, and after ~300Km, the engine behaviour became much better. After my second refueling, I no longer experience any 'chocking' and the engine seems happy.

As I mentioned, this engine needs 98 Octane to run smoothly, with full power and optimal fuel consumption.

[Guest]

Hi Guys,

As has been said, it does take at least two tankfuls of the higher grade fuel to alter the cars behaviour. The ECU is a learning unit and adapts properly after two full tanks! Also, if any of you continue to get this problem, it is a sign (as has already been said) of poor fuel quality which tends to show up more during cold start up. Problems with the fuel like this are usually water mixed in with it. BUT...also try the injector cleaner solution too. These new electronic injectors on the TSI engines gum up very quickly I am told by my friends in the trade especially on some fuels and this will cause poor running.

[xcyber]

This must be wrong! the salesman didnt say anything about 98 octane when I ordered my fabia 1.2 tsi DSG.

The brochure says 95 octane too! http://www.skoda.se/mediadb/_files/user_skodanew/Skoda_Fabia_web_46907.pdf (page 38).

Strange if this engine isnt tested enugh so they know what octane they run at?

IF.. there is a problem - I hope they have fixed the problem before I get my car in week 15!

Prices for fuel is expensive enugh in Norway as they are! About 13NOK each litre and 98 octane about 1.50 extra per litre. .

[benwiddowson]

I use 95 octane fuel, next choice is 100 octane fuel but it is not recommended by the manufacturer. At the fuel cap says 95 octane fuel.

By the way what is DI?

I have the fabia 1.2 tsi and the petrol cap says MINIMUM of 95 RON. I run mine of 99 with no issues now.

[aj.]

I've just taken delivery of a Fabia 105 TSi and find there is a supplement to the owners manual that applies to both Fabia and Roomster, it tells you to use unleaded 98 RON fuel but you can also use unleaded 95, however if you do they say that some loss of power is to be expected. It carries on to say that if neither 98 RON or 95 RON is available then you can fill with 91 RON in an emergency but only to drive with medium engine speeds and minimum engine load. When I ordered mine RON 95 was the fuel that was recommended for the engine by Skoda in the brochures etc (and still is in the online documentation and brochures). There are no convenient garages near me that sell 98 RON so looks like I'm going to have to live with the reduced power.

[xcyber]

I've just taken delivery of a Fabia 105 TSi and find there is a supplement to the owners manual that applies to both Fabia and Roomster, it tells you to use unleaded 98 RON fuel but you can also use unleaded 95, however if you do they say that some loss of power is to be expected. It carries on to say that if neither 98 RON or 95 RON is available then you can fill with 91 RON in an emergency but only to drive with medium engine speeds and minimum engine load. When I ordered mine RON 95 was the fuel that was recommended for the engine by Skoda in the brochures etc (and still is in the online documentation and brochures). There are no convenient garages near me that sell 98 RON so looks like I'm going to have to live with the reduced power.

It is totaly unacceptable from skoda to come with this information after the order have been placed! They must come up with a solution so the engine runs properly with unleaded 95!!

[stratosg]

I agree, but the worst of all is that in my country there is no 98 RON petrol, only 95, 100 and 100+ RON and priced at 1.56 euro per liter (the 95 one) and an average of about 1500 km per month, 95 RON petrol is one way road for me.

After 5 months and 9186 km on clock, i have an average consumption of 6.6 lt/100km and about 500 grammars of oil.

From times to times she still does not perform cold start, but even then the engine runs smoothly without having hick ups (bad idling).